Israel nonsense

[Partisan]

OK, I'm now a bit dischuffed to find out about this.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/middle_east/10572025.stm

Firstly the diplomat concerned should know better, but ultimately this was her private blog, she did not say that she shared Ayatollah Fadlallah's views, just that she respected him and enjoyed meeting with him!!

I didn't know the man, never met him, but have heard many different view points about him. The thing that they all seem to agree on was that he was not the spiritual leader of Hezbollah, he advocated the use of suicide bombs when fighting an aggressor (not just Israel), he declaimed the 11 Sept attacks, even after supporting the Beirut Barracks attacks. One thing I do seem to gather, in my view, is that he was a man of integrity who stood up for what he believed - even if I disagree with some or all of his viewpoints, I can respect him for that.

What I can't respect is Israeli's dictating who can say what about whom!! That starts to become very "1984" and hearkens back to a dark era in human history when Germans did the same thing to Jews.

WWII wasn't fought to liberate the Jews, although that was a great by product, it was fought against a tyrannical and monomaniacal power, which stifled and crushed other views and countries and justified it under the aegis of self protection - sounding familiar?

As far as I'm concerned the Israeli government is entitled to its views - but so am I, so is the free press and everyone else in the world, don't like what people are saying, either ignore it (current policy), or recognise that there might be some basis and do something about it.

Now done with Israel, I respect them and admire them, for their history, but have nothing good to say about their jackboots on the present and future, nor the unseeming influence that they seem to wield on the international community.

 

[MontyB]

Since we seem to be out of Israeli's right now I get to play counter point.

1. Don't the Chinese do the same thing with Taiwan?
2. Surely Israel or any other country has the right to be upset about comments supporting their opposition, the failing in this case is that corporations/governments follow the politically correct approach rather than just saying "too bad they have the right to an opinion".

The whole argument about free speech is predicated on the way we handle views we don't like.

I would also point out that weakness here is in those that allow themselves to be influenced not those doing the influencing.

 

[rattler]

Yes.:

"We believe that the spiritual leader of [Hezbollah] is unworthy of any praise or eulogising," a spokesman told the Israeli newspaper, Yediot Ahronot.
"If Hezbollah was firing missiles at London and Glasgow, would this leader still be called 'decent'?" he added.

Using the same rgument (ridiculous for strters), a nation starving a popultion of 500.000 to death amids off and on helping deceasing of great portions of sid populce by invading their territory and killing them indiscrimintely, is unworthy of ny prise or respect from my POV. Isrels terrorist government shooting phosphor at civilins cn be called "decent"?

Actually, around those questions the - non US/non mil - interntionl discussion revolves, those guys from Hezbollh, Hamaas nd Israel re just filling their pockets with their comissions on id delivery: 10% for Hamas nd Hezbollh leders, 5% for the Israeli leaders (dont belive me?: Google the evolution of their personl patrimony, from dish wsher to multi-millionaire in ajust a few years in many cases).

Rttler

(NOTE: The "A" key on my keyboard works erratically, sometimes not, sometimes fifing double/triple, sometimes norml)

 

[Partisan]

Since we seem to be out of Israeli's right now I get to play counter point.

1. Don't the Chinese do the same thing with Taiwan?
2. Surely Israel or any other country has the right to be upset about comments supporting their opposition, the failing in this case is that corporations/governments follow the politically correct approach rather than just saying "too bad they have the right to an opinion".

The whole argument about free speech is predicated on the way we handle views we don't like.

I would also point out that weakness here is in those that allow themselves to be influenced not those doing the influencing.

Monty, glad to have someone come back at me, as always you provide a great counter argument.

I agree, the concern should be with those that allow themselves to be influenced, but surely the open strong arm tactics on a "free" news organisation should be a source for concern for us all! Additionally this raises concerns about CNN, if it so willing to pander to the Israeli govt.

Also your point about China is well taken, after all they are as bad, if not worse than the Israelis. So what should we be doing with China?

 

[A Can of Man]

You can't really compare the China - Taiwan relationship with Israel - Palestine.
Although they have some similarities there are many marked differences.

The mainland Chinese and the Chinese in Taiwan share a common heritage. Those who are not native to Taiwan still have relatives, hometowns and ties on the mainland.

Although China does not freely allow weapons to be sold to Taiwan, it does not seem to be engaged in any significant blockade of Taiwan either.

 

[MontyB]

Monty, glad to have someone come back at me, as always you provide a great counter argument.

I agree, the concern should be with those that allow themselves to be influenced, but surely the open strong arm tactics on a "free" news organisation should be a source for concern for us all! Additionally this raises concerns about CNN, if it so willing to pander to the Israeli govt.

Also your point about China is well taken, after all they are as bad, if not worse than the Israelis. So what should we be doing with China?

Of course it should be of concern but I think we need to focus on where and what the problem is, it would appear to me that the management and objectivity of CNN is the first port of call here.

I personally think you will find that this is not specifically a CNN loves Israel relationship but more a CNN loves anyone in power that can benefit their ratings relationship and to be blunt I doubt there is a single major news outlet that does not have this relationship with governments however the reason new outlets have become this way is because we the consumer tune in every night to see this.

So if you want a genuinely independent and free media then as individuals we have to stop buying into the hype, put our support behind the few remaining news organisations that haven't become commercial and I guarantee you that if CNN, FOX or any of the other "mainstream" organisations saw a profit in being honest they would change over night.

As for China well that is easy, you recognise Taiwan and then point out to the Chinese that their vast economy relies heavily on the rest of the world buying their cheap shitty lead and melamine filled products and that when an economy collapses people get restless so their best interests in this case are to grin and bare it.