Hugo Chavez says Venezuela ready for war with Colombia

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rock45

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Hugo Chavez says Venezuela ready for war with Colombia


MEXICO CITY, March 9 (RIA Novosti) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has said the country's armed forces are ready for a war with Colombia should Bogota provoke it.
"In case of a provocation on the part of Colombia's armed forces or infringements on Venezuela's sovereignty, I will give an order to strike with Su aircraft and tanks. I will not let anyone disrespect Venezuela and its sovereignty," Chavez said Sunday on his weekly TV show, "Hello, President."
Chavez said this in response to Colombian Defense Minister Juan Manuel Santos's recent statements, which said that Colombia's military will keep killing rebels from the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) on the territory of other states.
Bilateral relations sharply aggravated after Colombia's military bombarded a camp of Colombian rebels in Ecuador in March 2008, killing FARC leader Raul Reyes as well as another 16 rebels.
In response, Chavez ordered the deployment of several thousand soldiers and tanks toward the border with Colombia. Chavez characterized Colombia's actions as violating Ecuador's sovereignty, and called Colombian President Alvaro Uribe "a criminal."
This week, Colombia's National Radio said citing a high-ranking intelligence source that nine people from the FARC General Staff hide in Venezuela and another two in Ecuador. The top management of the staff includes 31 people.
FARC is a Marxist-Leninist guerrilla group established in 1960s. It is considered a terrorist organization by the Colombian government, the U.S. and the EU. The group's revenues are believed to be partly obtained from drug trafficking and kidnapping.



Link
http://en.rian.ru/world/20090309/120481975.html
 
Chavez

The Su-30s would be difficult to stop but Colombians have Spike and other anti-tank missiles so Venezuela's 30 year old tanks can be stopped. I don't think Colombia would pass up a chance to take out one of the big FARC leaders, accidents happen.

You know sometimes in the thick jungle in the rain the border signs that read entering Venezuela are just hard to see.
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I'd take alarm to this... if Columbia dared make a move.

But, as usual, this is just South American politics: Giant Armies with no fighting.
 
If Chavez really wants to do something he'll do it. Whether the threat is real or imagined.
 
It's all jungles, rivers and hills over there I'd imagine. Can't see tanks being a major part in any of this stuff. Air, infantry and depending on roads, artillery.
 
03USMC said:
If Chavez really wants to do something he'll do it. Whether the threat is real or imagined.
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He now has a firm mandate from the people.

Also this could be just the ticket to divert attention from the oil industry, which has apparently suffered since nationalisation.

Argetina tried something similar in the early 80's with the Falkland Islands, this resulted in a breakout of extreme nationalism on both sides and the removal the Junta, after the Argentinian defeat.

This time a potential war would be much closer, not knowing enough about their respective military capabilities, but having a firm grasp of the terrain; I would say that this is a boil waiting to be burst and that either side can choose to do it at their leisure and convenience.

A major conflict between Venezuala & Columbia would be a nightmare as the other Latin American countries would have to weigh in on 1 side or the other, fairly quickly, then there goes the neighbourhood.
 
Venezuela has AMX-30 tanks and there are some land routes where battle could be fought. Both are major oil producers for the US, I'm sure United States would support Colombia in the long run if shooting broke out. Both countries wouldnt want anything to happen to their oil & gas assets period.

With Colombia's current fighting against FARC I would be rate Colombia's ground armed forces as better or more currently trained. A bunch of 30 year old tanks can be beat. The Flankers best weapons are Russian made anti-ship missiles I looked but didn't see any LGB, standoff missiles, etc. I'm not saying those items weren't sold just I see them listed as delivered.
 
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Obviously the USA would support Colombia. Think, its Hugo Chavez.

It would be a tight one, I guess Putin and Medvedev would support Venezuela, but I doubt it would be a long war [Considering the economical crisis].
 
Colombian update

Colombia military to get US$4 billion upgrade

Tuesday, 27 January 2009 14:19
Colombia's military will purchase roughly US$4 billion in military hardware including aircrafts, armored vehicles and small arms to upgrade and modernize its armed forces, El Tiempo reported Tuesday.

The upgrade will modernize several branches of the Colombian armed forces by supplying new military hardware, which will include naval vessels and submarines from France and Germany, and 25 training aircraft to be assembled in Colombia, said Vice Minister of Defense, Juan Carlos Pinzón.
By the end of the year the armed forces will receive 15 U.S. manufactured Black Hawk helicopters and five Russian-made MI-17 helicopters, and 20 105-mm artillery canons, Pinzón said.
And in March the Air Force will receive four Israeli-built KFir fighter jets, the first shipment of a total of 24 of the aircraft to be delivered new or reconditioned and modernized, Pinzón said.
The deal, to be financed through a special tax earlier decreed by the government, also includes 30 armored vehicles, 12 attack helicopters, 60 fast boats and other vessels, and Caravan and Super King aircraft. Through an accord with a U.S. manufacture, 25 training aircraft will be built in Colombia, Pinzón said.
An unspecified amount of unmanned aircraft are also included in the deal.
The deal also effectively makes Colombia an arms manufacturer -- and the only builder in the world to make Israeli-designed Galil rifles to be used as the official rifle of the Colombian soldier.

"One of the conversations we had with IMI (Israeli Military Industries, Ltd, the designer of the rifles) is to see the possibility to make ourselves a factory, or at least in part, for the next generation of Galil assault rifles," Pinzón said.
Through compensation agreements with international corporations, Colombia will receive the equivalent of $1.2 billion U.S. throughout 10 years reflected in trading technology and trading of knowledge and education. These agreements have been reached with important industries in Israel, the United States and France.



Link
http://colombiareports.com/colombia...mbia-military-to-get-us4-billion-upgrade.html

Colombia isn't staying still either thought I'll add this since I came across it.
 
Partisan said:
He now has a firm mandate from the people.

Also this could be just the ticket to divert attention from the oil industry, which has apparently suffered since nationalisation.
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Actually, I think Chavez might attack to divert attention from the collapsing Venezuelan economy, of which the oil industry is only a segment. He would get his tail kicked, and a lot of Venezuelan Soldiers killed, but that would be besides the point (and yes, the US might intervene on Colombia’s behalf I think as they are our ally and Chavez is a big, fat creep :evil:).

Nationalizing the oil industry (or anything else in Venezuela) is not going to address the underlying problems there. Neither Socialism, nor Kleptocracy, works as an economic or governmental model. Someone has to work and earn money to pay the bills - you can’t keep taking it from the “rich” or the “filthy imperialist capitalists” - no one has that kind of money (never mind the morality involved :() as Venezuelans will eventually find out.
 
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Gunner13 said:
Actually, I think Chavez might attack to divert attention from the collapsing Venezuelan econom, of which oil industry is only a segment. He would get his tail kicked, and a lot of Venezuelan Soldiers killed, but that would be besides the point (and yes, the US might intervene on Colombia’s behalf I think as they are our ally and Chavez is a big, fat creep :evil:).

Nationalizing the oil industry (or anything else in Venezuela) is not going to address the underlying problems there. Neither Socialism, nor Kleptocracy, works as an economic or governmental model. Someone has to work and earn money to pay the bills - you can’t keep taking it from the “rich” or the “filthy imperialist capitalists” - no one has that kind of money (never mind the morality involved :() as Venezuelans will eventually find out.
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Agreed he's taking this route for some reason other than National Soveriegnity and in reality could probably care less about the Columbians taking out FARC in Ecuador. Although he probably is worried he's next since he does harbor FARC leaders and formations as part of his Peoples Revolution aspirations ala Castro.

Given the fact that large numbers of the upper and middle class have left the country, he's running out of money and assets to sieze. And viable long term privately held business's as well as quite a few foriegn interests that have left or aren't doing the volume of business they used to.

The US could very well wiegh in on the side of Columbia. I see it as most likely providing CAS assets and probably AAA assets and anti armor assets to the Columbian military along with tech and advisory support. I don't think that ground assets would be provided as that would likely start a backlash in the region about Yankee Imperialism that could hurt Columbia more than help it.

Partisan said:
He now has a firm mandate from the people.

Also this could be just the ticket to divert attention from the oil industry, which has apparently suffered since nationalisation.

Argetina tried something similar in the early 80's with the Falkland Islands, this resulted in a breakout of extreme nationalism on both sides and the removal the Junta, after the Argentinian defeat.

This time a potential war would be much closer, not knowing enough about their respective military capabilities, but having a firm grasp of the terrain; I would say that this is a boil waiting to be burst and that either side can choose to do it at their leisure and convenience.

A major conflict between Venezuala & Columbia would be a nightmare as the other Latin American countries would have to weigh in on 1 side or the other, fairly quickly, then there goes the neighbourhood.
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Chavez's mandates from the people need to taken with a grain of salt. Alot of it is rhetoric on his part. He "has" a mandate from the people for everything he says. Past elections really don't bear that out. Oh he wins, but his last win came along with an attempt to change the constitution that would have effectively made him dictator for life.


Chavez is casting himself in a Castro/Che/Bolivar/San Martin image but his popularity is slipping he's been long on promise and short on delivery to the "worker" so he slips into anti-US, anti-Columbia mode to stir patriotic fervor and divert attention. The Argentine Junta and Falklands is actually a very apt comparison.

There maybe spill over, if it kicks off but I see it as being limited to Ecuador and possibly Peru and Boliva. Ecuador could ally it self with Venezuala as Chavez and Correa are pretty much singing from the Socialist Book of Hymns to a Workers Paradise as is Morales in Boliva.
The worst case scenerio is that of a combined attack from both Ecuador and Venezuala forcing the the Columbians to fight on two fronts.

Columbias reported troop strengths are:

254,300 Regulars

61,900 Reservists

they also have 136,000 Columbian National Police many of which are trained in COIN Op's and have been fighting FARC and Cartels for years. Part of CNP's mission statement is to augment the Military.

Venezuala reported troop strengths are:

115,000 Regulars

280,000 Reservists
(In this case probably only a portion are trained and combat effective units. Chavez made a great show a couple of years back in setting up alot of these units along the lines of Manuel Noriegas Dignity Battalions in Panama minimal training and equipment.)

Ecuador reported Troop strengths are:

57,100 Regulars

118,000 Reservists


In all cases the numbers include Army, Navy and Air Forces. In all cases only a portion of the reservists will be combat effective. Latin American Reserves are not like US Reserve Componets or European Reserve Componets. They are generally former conscripts or short term volunteers that are completing a requirement of service and subject to call up. Most receive no on going training. Columbia would have a slight edge here in that at least a portion of their reserves will probably have actual combat service against FARC or M19. But on the whole none of the reserve strengths should be counted as dependable combat units and would probably be used as individual replacement or augmentation forces.
 
03USMC said:
If Chavez really wants to do something he'll do it. Whether the threat is real or imagined.
Click to expand...
And I can still say without any real doubt that if he does the United States will use it as the opportunity we've been waiting for to turn his house into a grease spot: remember Manuel Noriega? Threaten US interest south of the Mexican border and you will pay the price.
 
The Other Guy said:
And I can still say without any real doubt that if he does the United States will use it as the opportunity we've been waiting for to turn his house into a grease spot: remember Manuel Noriega? Threaten US interest south of the Mexican border and you will pay the price.
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Concur, except we will turn HIM into a grease spot. :m16shoot:

Venezuelans are not a problem - it’s Chavez and his ilk who are. Getting rid of him would be a good object lesson for others too (as well as a service to humanity :smile: )

Like the motto says: Mortui Non Mordent!
 
So we don't like Chavez, bad news chaps - we aren't Venezualan and as such we have no right to interfere in their politics. He will come a cropper soon, mainly due to the economic crash that the whole world is suffering. Amongst other things the falling oil prices diminish incoming revenue, coupled with lack of infrastructure investment means that he can only sustain his social reform for so long before the bill comes due. It is the Venezualan people that I really feel sorry for, they've got very little and will end up with even less.
 
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