How do we deal with Pirate attacks?

[UnitedSomalia]

Back to the blame everyone else game I see?

Well well, at the rate we are sinking pirates nowadays the general concensus is that this particular problem pissing out of Somalia this time around might soon be contained.

If the goverment of Somalia are taking control of their land even better.
If not we will continue to sink pirates untill no one wants to travel that particular part of the sea.

Endgame time IMO.

//KJ.

Listen seriously what is your problem, do you have some sort of issue man? All you do is bark, please go do some research its as easy as googling before you bark away some sort of blame game conspiracy or denying facts since thats what you do best. What I have stated in my post is a known fact, do some research for your own good before you challenge me in something I know whole a lot more than you do. I am not blaming anyone I am stating facts and things that have occurred if you wana deny it that's your perogative but don't bark away accusations.

"There is no safety in unlimited technological hubris" (McGeorge Bundy)

 

[KJ]

Listen seriously what is your problem, do you have some sort of issue man? All you do is bark, please go do some research its as easy as googling before you bark away some sort of blame game conspiracy or denying facts since thats what you do best. What I have stated in my post is a known fact, do some research for your own good before you challenge me in something I know whole a lot more than you do. I am not blaming anyone I am stating facts and things that have occurred if you wana deny it that's your perogative but don't bark away accusations.

"There is no safety in unlimited technological hubris" (McGeorge Bundy)

Fact 1. Piracy originating in Somalia are a problem.
Fact 2. Somalia had their chance to end it, they didn´t.
Fact 3. Now we are.

Exactly wich of those facts are you having a problem with?

I hope Somalia is getting it´s s*it together, however history shows us that that is a long shot.
What accusations have I made? I simply stated that as is common in that part of the world there is always someone else to blame for every problem that exist.

Disputes over fishing rights have been solved peacefully by oher nations before.
It can be done.

So instead of snapping off on me on a forum you go research that, and pass that bit of wisdom on home.
That would be a better use of your internet time then getting riled up when I speak my mind.

I don´t bark, I call it as I see it.

Have a nice day.
KJ.

 

[mmarsh]

UnitedSomalia

This some truth in what you say about pollution and disrupution to local fishing (back in the 1990s) as I have read the report made to the UN as well. However the real reason Somalie fisherman switched to piracy was that it was simply more profitable. ALOT more protfitable. We are talking about making a few dozen dollars every year to making several million.

Its no different than any other pirate past or present. People become pirates because its a fast way to make more money then an average Somalie could dream of. The rewards of piracy are great but then again so are the risks.

 

[A Can of Man]

Not really. The risks involved are also minimal.

 

[wolfen]

Not really. The risks involved are also minimal.

Unless the pirates attack an unarmed ship.

 

[Dannan]

It's a "guerilla vs regular army" thing. The best way is to arm commercial ship.

 

[Yossarian]

It's a "guerilla vs regular army" thing. The best way is to arm commercial ship.

I agree, I would love to see some pirates roll out to attack a merchant ship, and have some expert private security guys up on the weather deck start shooting back.

 

[A Can of Man]

Actually just having lots of tear gas released onto the deck would encourage them to leave.

 

[Bloody Kangaroo...]

While i agree with the idea of having SF soldiers on board SOME ships and thus making the pirates think twice, it would not be a cost effective operation. Would any govt actually do this?

What about a number of smaller, faster military vessels able to cover large areas and respond quickly to SOS calls etc? these vessels could have SF troops or specialist boarding parties etc and/or snipers to repeat the rescue of Capt Phillips?

 

[A Can of Man]

Gets more complicated and the water is simply too wide for that sort of stuff. Tear gas dispensers on the deck would do a great job I think.

 

[BritinBritain]

While i agree with the idea of having SF soldiers on board SOME ships and thus making the pirates think twice, it would not be a cost effective operation. Would any govt actually do this?

The drop insurance rates would more then pay for a private security company to place operatives on board.

What about a number of smaller, faster military vessels able to cover large areas and respond quickly to SOS calls etc? these vessels could have SF troops or specialist boarding parties etc and/or snipers to repeat the rescue of Capt Phillips?

As I have stated before, the worlds oceans are too vast for any real and effective form of naval intervention. Even if a thousand smaller fast attack boats were deployed, they still wouldnt be enough to cover such a huge area.

 

[KJ]

While i agree with the idea of having SF soldiers on board SOME ships and thus making the pirates think twice, it would not be a cost effective operation. Would any govt actually do this?

What about a number of smaller, faster military vessels able to cover large areas and respond quickly to SOS calls etc? these vessels could have SF troops or specialist boarding parties etc and/or snipers to repeat the rescue of Capt Phillips?

Bad idea to give up the initiative to the pirates and force your Tier 1 assets to only react to threats.

Any and all dynamic breach operations means risks for the hostages.
Best case scenario is to let your Tier 1 assets act first and to react only as a back up.
IMO

//KJ.

 

[03USMC]

That's it in a nutshell. If the only forces utilized are reactive the problems continue although it might be a little less frequent.

This needs to go pro-cative.

 

[wolfen]

Actually just having lots of tear gas released onto the deck would encourage them to leave.

I'm thinking something more down the line of something that makes a really big bang

 

[Dannan]

Actually just having lots of tear gas released onto the deck would encourage them to leave.

aha, you are such a kind guy, I would prefer to get on you ship if I know its yours....

 

[Dannan]

The fact of the matter is, world navies cannot effectively cover such a vast expanse of the worlds oceans.

A far simpler and cost effective solution as I have stated many times is to employ an armed security team on board. A solution which proved very effective as shown by the owners of the Italian cruise ship, employing an Israeli security team who fought off a pirate attack recently.

That's why I suggest we do such things:
(1)Train sailors
(2)Give them weapons
(3)Authorize them to fight back

 

[A Can of Man]

aha, you are such a kind guy, I would prefer to get on you ship if I know its yours....

How would you like to stand on deck while I blow tear gas in your face for a good fifteen minutes?

 

[Dannan]

How would you like to stand on deck while I blow tear gas in your face for a good fifteen minutes?

What I wanna emphasize is that pirates fight for treasure and non-fatal weapons can not stop them, all right?

Tear gas might be efficient for protestors in plaza but can not work under this circumstance ,if I were a pirate.

The only thing that can prevent them from getting on your board is the risk of death.

 

[Insomniac]

The recent events of piracy off Somalia raises the question of how do we deal with these attacks?

One solution might be to take Pompey’s tactics from history.

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum/how-romans-dealt-pirates-t73989.html#post502747

However, to simply arm the Red Sea up to the hilt with military vessels wouldn’t be cost effective bearing in mind the fraction of vessels that are actually apprehended and the level of ransom’s sought. Bear in mind that the Pirates make sure there are no warships in sight before they seize the ship and they are careful to avoid unnecessary confrontation that may lead to deaths. They see it as a purely economic exercise. Moreover, no doubt Pompey had rather more discretion in his choice of action than we have today.

Another option might be to strike at the Pirates bases, however this means a land attack, something the US will be reluctant to undertake after their previous experience in Somalia.

Perhaps the merchant vessels themselves could be armed? However, with Oil tankers in particular this could be a dangerous option.

How about arming just a fraction of the vessels with hidden ‘Special Forces’ so the pirates don’t know which vessels they can safely apprehend? It would give them something to think about. Probably there would be too few interceptions.

Dead simple:
step one: stick a tanker full of oil, make it highly publicised that it's passing through somalian waters with a top speed of about 5knots. no escort, etc, etc.
step two: empty all oil out of tanker (in full secret) and fill with SF/normal soldiers with guns. the biggest we can afford.
step three: cruise through somalian waters.
step four: anything that attacks, blow it out of the water like a depth charge hitting a rowing-boat. actually, stick some depth charges in there as well. blow them all to royal buggery.

Wash, rinse, repeat with as many different oil tankers who will let a load of nutjob soldiers with guns on board.

Or, if you're feeling a lot more nasty (and have a knackered oil tanker you don't mind binning),
take one knackered old oil tanker. rig it up to drive via remote control. (have the remote control in a whirlybird up in the sky or just very far away on another boat.)
then..
step one: fit with either a) high-explosives (to blow it sky-high), or b) a petrol-ignition system (to torch the ugly f*ckers)
step two: cruise through somalian waters really slowly (as above)
step three: wait for pirates to board, and show their ugly faces in the bridge
step four: hit detonators/ignition system. blow the f*ckers out of the water/ set fire to them.

wash, rinse, repeat with as many spare oil tankers as you have.

 

[A Can of Man]

What I wanna emphasize is that pirates fight for treasure and non-fatal weapons can not stop them, all right?

Tear gas might be efficient for protestors in plaza but can not work under this circumstance ,if I were a pirate.

The only thing that can prevent them from getting on your board is the risk of death.

Get sprayed by tear gas for fifteen minutes, then we'll talk.
Your ass will jump right off the deck and into the water.
Is the option of the armed guards better? Yes, I think so. But the issues I was tackling were:
1) Sailors don't want to really fight back.
2) Security teams cost a lot of money and you have to keep paying them.