How Helpless are we(Americans)?

Duty Honor Country

Duty Honor Country

Active member
A few headlines from Hurricane Wilma caught my eye and made me mad enough to ramble about it here on the forum. The whole issue going down in Miami is getting food, ice and water to the victims of the hurricane. The system of distribution is pretty bad and people are mad. Governor Jeb Bush has taken the heat for the slow response in aid, but took a jab at people by saying, "People had ample time to prepare. It isn't that hard to get 72 hours worth of food and water."

You know what, I agree with him. If I ever lived in Florida, I would have at least 2 weeks of water sitting in my house somewhere. Hell, I live in Tennessee and I have a weeks worth of water just incase the power goes out and I need to sustain myself until the juice comes back on. Down in my basement, I have a propane camping stove and lantern with a few cans of fuel. I do not know about you, but my pantry could easily feed me for 2 weeks. I may not like eating plain pasta or 10 cans of beans, but you do what you have to do to survive. With everything in my house, I will be able to live on my own (quite comfortably too) without crying for government aid for 2 or more weeks. AND the cost of this self sustainment is at the most $200.

How am I suppose to have compassion for those in Florida who could have helped themselves but decided not to? Somebody is going to call me an :cen: hole for saying this, but bear with me. Has our society become so weak that we Americans cannot even take care of ourselves for 2 days in an emergency? Common Sense is becoming such a rare thing. You live in florida and you will get hurricanes, PLAN FOR IT! There was a guy in New Orleans who refused to leave because he had saved up over 3 months worth of food, water and cleaning supplies because of the threat of hurricanes. He is the example for the rest of us to follow. It is better to help your self than to plan poorly and expect others to pick up the slack. I firmly believe that true freedom, liberty and the persuit of happyness lies in ones self and not the government.

Doody
 
I agree with you wholeheartedly, Doody. My wife says that people here always have a "blizzard" mentality, meaning if there is any hint of a heavy winter storm or a hurricane in the summer or fall, they flock to the supermarket and clean out the bread, milk and so on. We always have more than enough food to live on for at least a week. Why people have to wait until the last minute and then blame everyone else is beyond me.
 
People have gone soft. There is this mentality of the world owing "you" something. Farmers and rednecks don't think this way and neither do most professional soldiers. One of my favourite stories about Katrina was some ol boy down in Biloxi who threw his stove, sleeping bag and dogs into the back of his truck and took off inland. He said he was quite alright hunting with his bow and sleeping with the dogs till they got rid of the stench of the dead bodies back in his neighborhood. I have taken a bit of flak from people, mostly city folk, who scoffed at my "survival kit" that I ALWAYS have. But ya know what, when the merde hits the ventaliteur I am not the one hungry and whinging. Its how I was raised and my time in the service reinforced it, always plan a backup and your backup needs to have a backup as well.
 
Its not just the US that has this problem, over here in the UK every winter people get gridlocked on the roads (cos of the silly season that is christmas) and occasionally snows. Now how many of those people, (most of them anticipating bad road conditions, long traffic jams and cold weather) actually get themselves prepared for this. Say by putting a blanket in the car taking a flask of coffee and some munchies for the trip you would be lucky if you found 1 in a 100. Its stupid I keep a sleeping bag, a stove, and some classic British army ration packs in my car
 
I agree with you on that Doody. Common sense is becoming rare. It do not hurt people to plan a "what if" scenario and make the proper measures to be as comfortable and secure as possible. Enough batteries, water, food and other accessories that comes in handy can easily be stored in a few cardboard boxes in the basement or somewhere else.

I drive long distances every day, some are pretty remote, and I have the proper measures in my car to deal with just about any scenario. Proper firstaid kit, a warm wool sweather and a jacket, gloves and a wool cap in case I get a car breakdown - engine oil, tools and some basic reserve parts "just in case".

I believe the "just in case" and "common sense" terms are about to be outdated - are we really that dependant of the state and gouvernment to help us if the :cen: hits the fan?
 
I think with a lot of people it is an attitude of mind, they have grown up where these sort of things don't happen and if they run out of some thing there is always a shop open some where, were they can buy what ever they want. When they are faced with problem like this they don't know what to do next and expect every one else to sort it out for them
 
I teach in daily life and when we go on a summer camp it is shocking to notice how far many of these are youngsters from nature. Earth is dirty, water in the lakes to swim in is unhygenic and the food isn't McDonalds... It makes me wonder how their kids will be. Ususally the following generation do the opposite, so let's hope so!
 
I carry an old Air Force parka and muk luks in my truck year around. There is an old Iver Johnson .22 pistol and a Leatherman in the pockets. My Wife made me put a useless first aid kit in the storage compartment. I think survival instinct is in some people just like total dependance is in some others. Anyone can pick up the necessities at the Army Surplus stores without paying a fortune. If I was faced with the imminent danger of a hurricane, I'd make a beeline for the surplus store while everyone else lined up at Walmart.
 
We're all quick to criticize Floridians. I live in Florida and resent the generalizations I have read here. I am survival school trained and practised and would defy anyone here to fare any better than I would.
How good are you going to be when you're 80+ years old? I volunteer to help such people in cases of emergencies. I work the shelters, I help my neighbors, I donate, collect, and distribute supplies through our church. I also operate emergency communications for the Red Cross. Don't tell me what you'd do if you lived in FL or what you'd do if this or that happened. Tell me what you have done in natural disasters. What did you do when the power went out for a couple of weeks? What did you do when those convenient stores ran out of food because the roads were impassible and they couldn't get restocked? What did you do when your neighbor had to get to dialysis and had no transportation? What did you do when a tree fell or your neighbor's car trapping her and no help could get in? I could tell you what I did but I think you might be able to guess. Florida has been hit by not 1 or 2 but 15 storms this year and we've come through them pretty well in my opinion. Nobody takes storms lightly in Florida. It sounds to me that you all think of yourselves as survival experts. That's all well and good but I don't worry just about myself during disasters, I just can't. I hope none of you has to endure a real natural disaster but if and when you you do, I would guess that you're in for a humbling experience. That's all I have to say. I thought a Floridian ought to speak up. Now I'll let you get back to your discussion.
 
The truly helpless, aged, hospital patients, and homebound should be first on the list of the City, neighbors, State, County, and Federal to get immediate help. I agree with that wholeheartedly and there were as many acts of helping others in Florida and Louisiana as there was looting and mayhem. But to think fast and take care of someone else, you have to first know how to take care of yourself or you're both goners. But it sounds like you are a man with his priorities straight and the ability to do just that, but there are so many more who could not do what you are trained to do. My hat is off to you and those like you, but do you agree that the able bodied took up too much time of the people who were there to help and drew on resources that should have been put to use helping the helpless? Those are the ones I'm not too thrilled with.

When I was growing up, there was no electricity or phone. We didn't have running water but a good well. Kerosine lamps were our lights and Mother had a kerosine cookstove, in a later house. One big fireplace was our central heat but the cracks in the walls sort of outperformed that. I,ve stood in front of that fireplace until I was smoking, and then run and jump in bed. In the first house I remember, we didn't have those amenities and I still carry a scar on the back of my hand where I touched a wood stove that was heat and cooking stove. Dad farmed and my oldest Brother hunted and trapped.

What you learned in survival school was the way we lived every day. There was poor (those who have some leftovers after meals) and there was Pore ( one and sometimes two meals a day.)

I can't end this without telling about the toilet that Dad built. He put it behind the smokehouse so it would be out of sight from the road. That put it on a grade. Dad was a big man and he was the first to "ride" that privy down the hill, all us kids were rolling laughing, which when he got through staring us down, he got to laughing too. Man, I don't miss those days, but survive? We survived, not by today's standards but we survived.
 
THAT's funny. :lol:

DTop, I can't speak for others but the criticism voiced from this poster was for those able bodied folks who failed to prepare. Only a callous moron would lay that same blame on the feet of the elderly and indigent. Your selfless efforts to help your fellow man in a disaster are well commended but you don't need anyone to tell you that. Where I was raised THAT was the norm, the standard of behaviour so it would never occur to me to behave otherwise in a major disaster or when a neighbour's field was aflame.

What really chaps my hindquarters is to see able bodied 20-40 year olds in middle class neighbourhoods whinging about how no one is helping them.

Neither this nor my previous post was intended as a self-righteous proclamation of my superiority but rather an impotent rant about the state of some, but not all, of my fellow humans who fail to help themselves first before looking and blaming someone else for their bad fortune.
 
FULLMETALJACKET said:
just give me a way to purify water and some bread. :p
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Both can be purchased in an Army/Navy surplus store. All you need is a few cases of C and K rations.
 
Doody said:
A few headlines from Hurricane Wilma caught my eye and made me mad enough to ramble about it here on the forum. The whole issue going down in Miami is getting food, ice and water to the victims of the hurricane. The system of distribution is pretty bad and people are mad. Governor Jeb Bush has taken the heat for the slow response in aid, but took a jab at people by saying, "People had ample time to prepare. It isn't that hard to get 72 hours worth of food and water."

You know what, I agree with him. If I ever lived in Florida, I would have at least 2 weeks of water sitting in my house somewhere. Hell, I live in Tennessee and I have a weeks worth of water just incase the power goes out and I need to sustain myself until the juice comes back on. Down in my basement, I have a propane camping stove and lantern with a few cans of fuel. I do not know about you, but my pantry could easily feed me for 2 weeks. I may not like eating plain pasta or 10 cans of beans, but you do what you have to do to survive. With everything in my house, I will be able to live on my own (quite comfortably too) without crying for government aid for 2 or more weeks. AND the cost of this self sustainment is at the most $200.

How am I suppose to have compassion for those in Florida who could have helped themselves but decided not to? Somebody is going to call me an :cen: hole for saying this, but bear with me. Has our society become so weak that we Americans cannot even take care of ourselves for 2 days in an emergency? Common Sense is becoming such a rare thing. You live in florida and you will get hurricanes, PLAN FOR IT! There was a guy in New Orleans who refused to leave because he had saved up over 3 months worth of food, water and cleaning supplies because of the threat of hurricanes. He is the example for the rest of us to follow. It is better to help your self than to plan poorly and expect others to pick up the slack.

Doody
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Totaly agree! Its not a rare thing that a hurrican will hit Floridia, its not like it has not happened before, yes it was alot worse then they had been before and I think it supprised not only those who lived there but also the government, I don't think they expected it to be as savere as it was so it will take extra time to prepare and send help, but as you said I do think its is mostly the people living there that has to be prepared, its their responsability and as its a thing that accurs often it shouldnt be a supprise, you always see people rushing to the supermarkets as a hurricane is comming, I dont get it! Wouldnt it have been better to get this food along time before, well someone might say that they dont know if its comming or not a month or more before, true but they know that IT WILL HAPPEN, its not that it will all of a sudden stop. I guess people live in a short time period, they don't seem to be able to plan ahead.

And those stupid idiots thats just making the situation worse, making it harder to help and then blaiming someone else for not beeing there is stupid in my opinion, if you make it worse you shouldnt be crying the no one is helping you, especially those that loot attack people and such idiotic things. I would have thought that such a situation would make people more aware to help others (in some cases this is what they do and they should be thanked) it seems that the mojority seems to see it as an opertunity to make it worse then blaim it on someone else. Something I do not like! Help each other instead of making it worse for yourself and others! :roll:

You dont have to buy Milk and other shot date products, there are food that will be good for atleast 50+ years, cans is a great thing. its not supposed to be a 5 star resturant meal, its there to keep you alive! Cans is also good in that they can take quite a beat still being intact and dont those can float? Never tried it so I'm not sure but it is a possibility atleast even though its leaning towards not being able to float but it duesnt reallt matter, aslong as its not too deep and that they are intact is the most important.
 
Missileer said:
I carry an old Air Force parka and muk luks in my truck year around. There is an old Iver Johnson .22 pistol and a Leatherman in the pockets. My Wife made me put a useless first aid kit in the storage compartment. I think survival instinct is in some people just like total dependance is in some others. Anyone can pick up the necessities at the Army Surplus stores without paying a fortune. If I was faced with the imminent danger of a hurricane, I'd make a beeline for the surplus store while everyone else lined up at Walmart.
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Why call a first aid kit useless? It can quicly hender a big bleeding, maybe not stop it but it will be handy to have at hand right where you are they are there for a reson (a volvo has one as standard).
 
AlexKall said:
Missileer said:
Why call a first aid kit useless? It can quicly hender a big bleeding, maybe not stop it but it will be handy to have at hand right where you are they are there for a reson (a volvo has one as standard).
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Because it is a cheapie. It doesn't have a pressure bandage or suitable tourniquet.
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Missileer said:
AlexKall said:
Missileer said:
Why call a first aid kit useless? It can quicly hender a big bleeding, maybe not stop it but it will be handy to have at hand right where you are they are there for a reson (a volvo has one as standard).
Click to expand...

Because it is a cheapie. It doesn't have a pressure bandage or suitable tourniquet.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Oh that explains it, I see your point now :D
 
First aid kits available to the general public in the states are really pretty useless Alex. They are full of bandaids, some alcohol or iodine wipes, an eyewash bottle, scissors and waterproof tape and maybe a cold pack. Pretty useless in a real emergency. More than once I have thanked God for the field expedient training the US Army gives.
 
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