Historic Uses OF WMD in Battle: Events in History

Mark Conley

Mark Conley

Active member
This is a new topic devoted to the posting of known uses of weapons of mass destruction through out history.

These weapons can nuclear, biological, toxicological, chemical, directed energy, or physical in nature. Lets automatically disuade the discussion of the use of the atomic bombs on Hiroshima and nakasaki: those topics have been discussed on another post.

Let just see what the people in this forum know about these uses.

My contribution: First use of a directed energy weapon: According to Roman writers who chronicled the life of Archimedes, the mathematician was a devoted subject of Hiero II, ruler of Syracuse, and spent part of his career designing and building weapons to defend Syracuse -- catapults, pulley hoists and levers for disabling enemy ships and siege towers. The ancient historians Polybius, Plutarch and Pliny the Elder all mention such inventions, although none was alive in Archimedes' lifetime. Some Greco-Roman historians also assert that during the Roman siege of Syracuse from 214 to 212 B.C., at the height of the Second Punic War, Archimedes used bronze mirrors to focus sunlight on Roman ships and set them on fire.

A lot of people poo pooed this idea as crazy, couldnt happen. Go to the following link, and learn what happened when a bunch of modern greeks held up polished bronze mirrors on a boat to see if it would work:

http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/Mirrors.htm

let see what you folks come up with. :D
 
During the Siege of Caffa in 1346, the bubonic plague broke out among the Muslim invaders. The disease was new and unknown to the Muslims. They flung diseased corpes over the city walls which infected the Christian defenders. The idea was a success, and the disease led to the fall of Caffa.

The story is controversial and its authenticity is often disputed, but it is very well-known and documented in many places.

Think>Push>Talk.

Whoops sorry about that sir :oops:
 
unit 371

unit 371 in the jap army used anthrax as well as other chemicals in their fighting against china. they invaded in 1931 and went till 1945.
 
If you ever get a chance, try reading the book "Devils Gluttony". This one usally was available overseas and not in the US, but is very good in the techical details about Unit 731.

Another good book to read is "A higher form of Killing". thisone deals mostly with chemical warfare programs, although the story of the brits intended use of anthrax has a very notable chapter.

:D
 
in nam ( 1969 i think ) the americans sprayed "agent orange" a concoction of some of the most lethal diseases and chemicals known to man. "agent orange" not only killed thousands of civvies, but left the soil and the women infertile. those that were lucky enough to be able to have babies gave birth to mutants, with protruding eyeballs and other deformities.
 
Excuse me, but would you care to back up some of the outrageous claims you just made :?:

Agent Orange was/is a defoliant and while it is somewhat toxic to human on an immediate basis, the true problem with it (other than damage to the trees) is that it causes cancer in those exposed to it. I have never heard that it also caused birth defects - especially those you mention. Be so kind as to site some sources.
 
the vietnamese folks. there's a pic somewhere, let me find it.......


and anyway.....i never said that it was true, just a rumour, but when you get pics like this:

AO.jpg

AO2.jpg

AO3.jpg

AO4.jpg


the mind starts to wonder........ :?

check out www.angelfire.com and click on hell USA or something.
 
I took a quick look at some of the Agent Orange website and most of them are run by lawyers seeking plaintiffs for lawsuits or anti-US rant pages. I was not able to find any mention of scientific studies that link Agent Orange to birth defects. I am definitely not saying that it is not possible or didn't happen, just pointing out that you can find anything on the web and most of that is not true (just look at Snopes.com).

That would seem to disqualify, for now, Agent Orange as a WMD, unless you are a tree of course :(
 
you should have seen this picture that i was trying to find.....it was horrible...but yes, you're right.
 
well some more information about agent orange:

Guys, it wasnt the defoiliant that was the problem. It was contamination with TCDD, or dioxin. TCDD is one of a family of dioxins, some found in nature, and are cousins of the dibenzofurans and pcb's.

http://www.lewispublishing.com/orange.htm this is a fairly impartial site.

you see, there were plenty of herbicides used in Viet nam. Only the orange has been suspect to date.

Just to give you idea about how the US officials feel about dioxin, they bought and closed a small town in missouri because of the widespead contamination of diesel fuel with dioxins that had been sprayed on the roads to control dusts.

It wasnt deliberate. It just happened that way. But it was because it was a contaminant, and not the defoiliant itself, that caused the Government to be able to say with a straight face, that the defoiliant was safe, and not the cause of all the problems.
 
OK, I did some more research and dioxins are linked to birth defects and other nasty issues. However, all the reasearch was on dioxins in general, not Agent Orange in particular, and none of the studies were conducted in Viet Nam.

So we are left with a possible link to the problems VEK illustrated, but no conclusive proof as to the source. :(
 
Well,i read all the post on this one and the Agent Orange code name for mixture of 2,4,5-T (2,4,5.-trichlorophenoxyacetic acid; 545.4 Kg/m3) and 2,4-D (2,4-dichlorophenoxyacetic acid; 485.1 kg/m3), altogether weighing 1 285 kg/m3; a herbicide; associated with the (2,4,5-T moiety is the impurity dioxin (2,3,7,8-tetrachlorodibenzo-p- dioxin)was an herbicide employed during Viet Nam War. Agent Orange was not the only herbicide sprayed in Vietnam although, due to its intensified usage, it is the herbicide most commonly mentioned and blamed for health problems in connection with that period in history. There were two other herbicides, an insecticide and a chemical irritant used during the Viet Nam. They each were called by code names: Agent Blue, Agent Orange, Agent White, CS and Malathion.
 
Marksman,

Yes that is in line with the material I found as well. However, we still have an inconclusive mess here - lots of use, lots of anecdotal evidence, but no conclusive research. Scary as those photos are, we simply don't know with any certainty what caused it. :(
 
OK, geting back to our main topic:

Lord Amherst & The Smallpox Blankets (A story I had heard about in High School History, but was never able to confirm):

Lord Amherst was commanding general of British forces in North America during the final battles of the so-called French & Indian War (1754-1763). He won victories against the French to acquire Canada for England and helped make England the world's chief colonizer at the conclusion of the Seven Years War among the colonial powers (1756-1763).

Despite his fame, Amherst's name became tarnished by stories of smallpox-infected blankets used as germ warfare against American Indians. These stories are reported, for example, in Carl Waldman's Atlas of the North American Indian [NY: Facts on File, 1985]. Waldman writes, in reference to a siege of Fort Pitt (Pittsburgh) by Chief Pontiac's forces during the summer of 1763:

“…Captain Simeon Ecuyer had bought time by sending smallpox-infected blankets and handkerchiefs to the Indians surrounding the fort….”. This is an early example of biological warfare, as it started an epidemic among the local Indians. Amherst himself had encouraged this tactic in a letter to Ecuyer.

Some people have doubted these stories; other people, believing the stories, nevertheless assert that the infected blankets were not intentionally distributed to the Indians, or that Lord Jeff himself is not to blame for the germ warfare tactic. However, recent research based on military correspondence and letter in Lord Amhert’s own handwriting remove all doubt about the validity of the stories about Lord Jeff and germ warfare.

As to whether the plans actually were carried out, Parkman has this to say: “…in the following spring, Gershom Hicks, who had been among the Indians, reported at Fort Pitt that the small-pox had been raging for some time among them....”

http://www.nativeweb.org/pages/legal/amherst/lord_jeff.html

Ouch, looks like it worked :(
 
I have a little summary on my website...
Some are a little in the conspiration theory side but reported in too many places to be ignored...
1346: Tatars in Crimea use plague-infected corpses against Italian colonists.

1763: British Gen. Jeffrey Amherst 's name became tarnished by stories of smallpox-infected blankets used as germ warfare against American Indians.

WW1: Close to 1.000.000 of gassed casualties.

1920: The British use chemicals against Kurds.

1935: Italians use Mustard gas in what is going to become Ethiopia.

1936: Japan invades China and poison rice.

WWII: No military use of Chemicals but the Germans developed new nerve and blood agents and used the ZyKlon B gas in concentration camps. About a thousand Italians die from exposure to a gas leaked from a sunken American ship.

1968: Utah: 6400 sheep die from exposure to Vx gas from the Dugway proving ground.

Vietnam war: Sarin and other agents might have been used. The famous defoliant, Orange agent, had side effect on people exposed to it.

1970: CIA uses a virus to kill Cuban pigs.

1980: US accuses Russian troops of using chemicals in Afghanistan.

1984: Iraq uses chemicals against Iranian forces.

1988: Saddan Hussein uses chemicals against Kurd civilians in the town of Alabjah.

1991: About 50 people die from Anthrax after an Iraqi chemical plant is bombed by US planes.

1995: A Japanese cult uses Sarin gas in a subway in Tokyo.

2001: Anthrax terror in Florida and Washington D.C., USA
 
As far as Nukes go, we have WW2 and Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
As far as Dirty Bombs go, that is to say using radioactive material to contaminate an area, I remember the German ecologists in the 80ies spreading radioactive material around a Nuke plant and claiming it was leaking and was a hazard for the population. They wanted it shut down! :p
 
Hmm, OK. However:

Vietnam war: Sarin and other agents might have been used. The famous defoliant, Orange agent, had side effect on people exposed to it.
Click to expand...

The use of sarin in Viet Nam was related to the Tailwind scandal and that was shown to be a hoax (just ask CNN). The jury is still out on Agent Orange and its effect on the civilian popluation. Lots of claims, but no proof. See previous discussion.

WWII: You should also add the use of carbon monoxide in the concentration camps by the Germans.

About a thousand Italians die from exposure to a gas leaked from a sunken American ship.
Click to expand...

Not familiar with this one - can you elaborate?

1980: US accuses Russian troops of using chemicals in Afghanistan.
Click to expand...
It wasn't just the US that made this accusation (just ask the Afganis) and they also used/supplied it for use in Cambodia in the 1970s if I recall correctly :(
 
Eric is referring to the leakage from mustard gas containers aboard an american ship in an italian harbor...yet the figure of a thousand civillian casualties hes talking about is an estimate: its not really known how many may have actually died, because most of them ran away from the city because of the pasting.

heres a good impartial site that explains what happened:

http://www.historynet.com/wwii/blluftwaffeadriatic/index1.html


On December 2nd, 1943, German bombers attacked American tankers and munitions ships in Bari Harbor off the southeast coast of Italy. They sank sixteen ships, partially destroyed four more, and set off at least two major explosions. The fires burned while hundreds of oil-soaked men were pulled out of the water.

At first, many of the survivors seemed to be all right, though a few mentioned the odd smell of garlic. Soon they began showing symptoms -- stinging eyes, skin lesions, a variety of internal problems. Four survivors died later the first day, nine the next. By the end of a month 83 men, out of the 617 who'd made it to the hospital, had died. Something bad was going on.

One of the ships (the USS John Harvey), it seems, had held 100 tons of mustard gas. Later, the Army claimed it'd been there as a deterrent -- a deterrent which had inexplicably been made top secret. We were lucky that most of the mustard gas burned off in the fires. The small part of it that'd been absorbed into floating oil was what did all the damage. And so this Bay of Bari incident produced the only mustard gas casualties in WW-II -- Americans killed by American gas.

:D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top