senojekips
Active member
Well,.. when are the homos going to learn that their behaviour is unacceptable to a civilised society? They are taking longer than a monkey.
Government Laws on Marriage
Rob Henderson
Banned
Or the rest of us could learn that they are just people like you and me, and that we need to accept that just because they aren't exactly like us, we shouldn't shun them or deny them a basic privilege of our society. That would be like me saying you shouldn't be allowed to get married because you are an atheist. It's all a matter of personal views... As a minority view point, you should know all about wanting to just be accepted for you as yourself, not for what you do or don't believe in.
senojekips
Active member
Make up your mind, they are either just like us, or they are not just like us.
The fact that they only have one nose, or two opposable thumbs is not reason enough to say they are just like me. The similarities are not what we a debating, it is the dissimilarities, and the fact that they live an antisocial lifestyle.
They are no more like me, than I am like the blokes who committed the 9/11 atrocities.
major liability
Active member
Explain how it is an anti-social lifestyle. I always thought the stereotype was of promiscuous gays who get around. Homos who parade and make a big deal out of it are self-important idiots, but simply being gay doesn't automatically make you a fool like that. They just get their fair share of stupidity like any other group.
Rob Henderson
Banned
You are like the blokes who committed the 9/11 atrocities. They had feelings, they had thoughts, they had dreams. They might have been different dreams, but the same thought processes that go on in your brain probably went through theirs at some point in their life... The fact that you are denying these similarities does nothing but further reveal your ignorance and closed-mindedness. Like your "interpretation" of my comment about them being similar to us. They do not have to be IDENTICAL to us to be LIKE us. They are not the same word, and therefore, are not the same. They can be similar without being exactly like you and me.
You're correct, we're debating the dissimilarities, but in order to do that, I'm showing you that you are similar, so that maybe you won't see the differences as so crucial to your passing judgement on them.
It's like this... If there are 4 men in a room, two are gay, and two are not. If one of the straight guys is a jerk to women, and one of the gay guys is a jerk to women, are they not both jerks? Does the fact that the one guy is gay really matter? People are people Spike, regardless of sexual orientation/preference, they are still people like you and me. If a fellow man was in trouble, or being treated unfairly, any DECENT human being would go to his aid, not turn the other way because "he's different." I understand that homosexuality becoming more normal scares you. We fear that which we do not know. But you have to look around you... The world is changing, and we must either change with it, or be left behind. You cannot hold on to your old-school, fundamentalist views forever, because the rest of the world won't. I promise you the day is soon coming where gays will be allowed to marry freely, just like the rest of us. The day is soon coming where they won't be denied a choice that the rest of us take so lightly.
We use the Civil Rights Movement as an example of change... I ask you to again take a look at it... At the beginning of the Civil Rights Movement, was there support from those who were against the idea of it? NO. Of course not. They didn't want to change. But more and more people realized that it doesn't matter what color their skin is, they are still people; just like you and me. (Is this all sounding familiar?) Gay Rights is the same thing. There isn't much support from the fundamentalist, conservative side of the field. But sooner or later, they will start to realize (just like they did 75 years ago) that just because a person has a different sexual preference than someone else, is not a reason to deny them happiness. It's not a reason to discriminate against them in the workplace, or in the classroom, or ANYWHERE. The day IS coming, and you had better be ready for it.
senojekips
Active member
Your views are all very romantic, but unfortunately not even vaguely close to the truth. For a start, they are dead, and as yet I am very much alive.
You make assumptions about others based merely on your own highly "romantic' views of the world. Unfortunately for you, the majority of civilisation and me in particular disagree with your "airy fairy" views.
Rob Henderson
Banned
I never said that you were identical to them, only that you were like them. You have similarities with every other human on this planet. It's your blatant avoidance of this truth that I refer to when I speak of your ignorance. You cannot simply deny the existence of these similarities. If you do, then it's YOU who has the fantasy view of the world, not me.
Again, you provide me no substantial argument, only the babbling of one who lives in the blissfully ignorant bubble of denial. There are certain similarities between the two "movements" are there not? Can you deny that?
What assumptions am I making? Please expound on that accusation.
Again, you provide me no substantial argument, only the babbling of one who lives in the blissfully ignorant bubble of denial. There are certain similarities between the two "movements" are there not? Can you deny that?
What assumptions am I making? Please expound on that accusation.
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Rob Henderson
Banned
Yes, sir.
BritinBritain
Per Ardua Ad Astra
Hasnt this thread flogged itself to death?
The fact of the matter is, some support gay marriage, others don't.
The fact of the matter is, some support gay marriage, others don't.
rattler
Active member
Interesting:
I think along the same big lines as you, but vote differently, and I use (partially) the same arguments for my take that you do:
- I Support Gay Marriage.
- The Government Has No Right To Say Who Someone Can or Can't Marry.
- This Doesn't Affect Me, Why Should I Deny It To Someone Else?
- Laws Against Gay Marriage Are A Step Back For Society.
- Gay Pride Parades Are Ridiculous.
Being gay is just that, like being hetero, no difference from my POV. No reason to be proud of either, none of both states is your personal achievement (which would give you the right to be proud). Basically, I think the "Gay Pride" thing comes from the guys being proud of having found the guts to come out of the closet. (?)
Along the same lines as you, I believe that if you want to be gay: Fine.... keep it in the bedroom or at least act responsible in public. Like I would tell every hetero. Re: the public sex acts, they are not at all confined to the gay community, I think its a sign of the times (I dont like it, but who gives a damn, and who should): Check the Love Parade in Berlin: Same layout, hetero (if you look for the expressive details you describe, the - hetero - vids are out there).
Again, as you state (slight differences here as I am not Catholic), I also have very close people to me that are gay. Both male and female.... I have no issue with them being gay. As a Protestant I feel I am not to judge them marrying someone but that that is an issue between them, and God. It is the same issue with abortions. I am against abortions but I will not support any law outlawing them. My logical conclusion: I will not support any law outlawing gay marriages.
Again with your next argument, you are spot on: I am also 100% against the State stepping in and saying who can and can't get married. Even if I were against homosexual relationships (which I am not as for the reasons above) I would stand up and support them getting the right for marriage. The State has no right to deny them that right. Just as the State has no right to deny me my rights to free speech (skipped the arms bit as it is not part of my constituion, add other rights here).
Last one I can again subscribe fully: You cannot have a one set of rights while not having another. You cannot give the State power over matters like this. Because once that is done the State will expand.... and that is bad.
Politicians are supposedly (thats the idea of representative democracy) representing their society, societey changes over years, so the laws will change (eventually, the filter through representation is a good shield against fast - and hence often wrong - decisions, something IMHO that we can only fully appreciate once we have grwon older).
My take,
Rattler
The Other Guy
Spam King
New idea on my front...
Eliminate civil marriage. Make the Government version a civil union for everyone. Marriage shall go back to being a religious-only thing, supporting seperation of church and state. Use the same rules that apply to the current civil marriage, but under a different name accessible to all. This also preserves the "sanctity of marriage."
Eliminate civil marriage. Make the Government version a civil union for everyone. Marriage shall go back to being a religious-only thing, supporting seperation of church and state. Use the same rules that apply to the current civil marriage, but under a different name accessible to all. This also preserves the "sanctity of marriage."
Rob Henderson
Banned
Hmmm... Interesting concept... I'd be for it.