Gays in military? - Page 9




 
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November 12th, 2006  
Padre
 
 
Hereís my observation on the topic. Iím lucky to be in two uniformed branches Ė the Australian Army and Navy. Itís a rare privilege.

I have met gays in the army and the navy although most of them are lesbians. Gay males are rare in the Australian Services but we do have them. Lesbian soldiers and sailors seem to be fully accepted and they have plenty of female friends (straight and gay) inside their Service. I have never seen or had reported to me any incidents or examples of prejudice, discrimination, or harassment towards lesbian soldiers, sailors, recruits or officers.

Gay males however do cop some heat but not from their superiors or the Defence system which actually protects their rights. They do find themselves on the outer with other males in the Services or are made fun of - usually behind their backs. They have few friends inside the Service. The stronger willed ones stay in the Service but many eventually leave. "Masculine" gay males are treated a lot better than "effeminate" gay males. The latter tend not be survive training but thats because they can't handle the rigors of training. There is no harassment of any of them as such, but what tends to happen is that their equals or peers in the platoon or ship shun them. On social occasions like parties and BBQís they are not invited. Conversations with them are kept to polite short exchanges. If a male soldier, sailor, or recruit is thought to be gay or is public about his homosexuality it does receive an adverse reaction among his fellow platoon / squad members. Again, his superiors donít seem to be bothered. The negative reaction comes mostly from the gay memberís peers.

In the cases I know of, the homosexual soldier/sailor can do his/her job just as well as anybody. Their physical and mental skills are up to the tasks that their category or Corps demand. The hopeless oneís donít get through training just like the straight oneís donít get through if they can't hack the pace.

I tend to support the ďdonít ask donít tellĒ policy, mostly in relation to gay males not so much in relation to lesbians. Maybe itís an imperfect policy. I strongly advise gay males not to flaunt their homosexuality even if they are in an environment where straight guys are loud about their attraction to females or boast of their sexual conquests. If the gay male did, it does affect morale and invites a negative reaction in most young males.

I'm not saying gay males should be banned from the Armed Services but it is my observation that their known presence in a platoon or ship does have a negative affect. Interestingly, from my observations, lesbians are more accepted in the Armed Services. Other people and in other countries may have different observations or experiences, but these have been mine.
November 12th, 2006  
bulldogg
 
 
Dont ask dont tell doesn't work because it can be used to blackmail a service member into collaborating with a foreign agent into revealing information in exchange for their silence on a career ending piece of information.
November 12th, 2006  
Missileer
 
 
Padre, I think, IMHO, that females are more at ease and accepting of the situation of serving with lesbians than males are when in the same situation with homosexuals. At least I haven't heard of an attack on a known lesbian by straight women. I think we men are wired differently when it comes to anything effeminent in males although we seem to accept a lesbian friend more readily than a gay male friend. At least that's the way we are portrayed in literature and movies.
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November 12th, 2006  
Prince
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
Padre, I think, IMHO, that females are more at ease and accepting of the situation of serving with lesbians than males are when in the same situation with homosexuals. At least I haven't heard of an attack on a known lesbian by straight women. I think we men are wired differently when it comes to anything effeminent in males although we seem to accept a lesbian friend more readily than a gay male friend. At least that's the way we are portrayed in literature and movies.
that is true. i think it is because men like to be strong and tough, usualy to impress either girls, or their mates and anyone who differs from that is targeted as abnormal.
straight men are alot more accepting of lesbians because the majority of men i have met, (and i meet alot through my sport) think lesbianism is a turn on.
it also happens the other way too. most of my girlfriends think guys kissing is hot.
dunno why that is but guess its that way for a reason.

what is the big deal with gays anyway. hell they are just the same as any other man. what they do behind closed doors, or in this instance, on their leave, is their busyness.
November 12th, 2006  
Senior Chief
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince
that is true. i think it is because men like to be strong and tough, usualy to impress either girls, or their mates and anyone who differs from that is targeted as abnormal.
straight men are alot more accepting of lesbians because the majority of men i have met, (and i meet alot through my sport) think lesbianism is a turn on.
it also happens the other way too. most of my girlfriends think guys kissing is hot.
dunno why that is but guess its that way for a reason.

what is the big deal with gays anyway. hell they are just the same as any other man. what they do behind closed doors, or in this instance, on their leave, is their busyness.
If it is wrong in God's eyes it doesn't matter what doors you are behind, your sins will find you out.
November 13th, 2006  
GI_JOEJK
 
 
Interesting discussion here. How many of you guys have ever worked with gays before?? Well, I have. It was back a few years while I was in college, I worked for the Starbucks coffee chain. My manager and a few coworkers were openly gay. Until then, I have never even known anyone who was gay, so it was quite a shock to me at first. So, from a point of three years of experience, these are my conclusions;

1. They are very diligent and hard workers, and you could count on them to do their job.
2. The gay guys I worked with had differing levels of depression, that made them moody, and many used drugs like crystal meth. I heard later (from a family member in the medical industry) that the vast majority of gays have this problem, and that hard drug use is rampent.
3. When they get horny, they WILL hit on you, and do and say things (in public) that would normally get a strait man fired. I could tell you stories that would make you blush...

So how would this reflect them being in the military? You be the judge. I for one, will keep my thoughts to my self on this subject.
November 15th, 2006  
Kirruth
 
 
Well, my view is that if somebody has the capacity to march, shoot straight, and love their country beyond all imagining, they have the right to be considered for the Armed Forces.

Many gay people served with distinction in both World Wars in the British Military (it was illegal, but people didn't have time to care), and most European countries militaries these days do not care what people's sexuality is.

What is important is people's capacity to get the job done and to win this war on terror, rather than what they do in their private lives.
November 15th, 2006  
Prince
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GI_JOEJK
Interesting discussion here. How many of you guys have ever worked with gays before?? Well, I have. It was back a few years while I was in college, I worked for the Starbucks coffee chain. My manager and a few coworkers were openly gay. Until then, I have never even known anyone who was gay, so it was quite a shock to me at first. So, from a point of three years of experience, these are my conclusions;

1. They are very diligent and hard workers, and you could count on them to do their job.
2. The gay guys I worked with had differing levels of depression, that made them moody, and many used drugs like crystal meth. I heard later (from a family member in the medical industry) that the vast majority of gays have this problem, and that hard drug use is rampent.
3. When they get horny, they WILL hit on you, and do and say things (in public) that would normally get a strait man fired. I could tell you stories that would make you blush...

So how would this reflect them being in the military? You be the judge. I for one, will keep my thoughts to my self on this subject.

i agree there, though not all gays will hit on you...alot of gay's hide their sexuality to the point that they will marry and have kids fearing that people will find out. then again there are those who'll hit on you in the main street lmao.

as for the depression...that kinda comes with it. alot of gay men hate the fact they are gay and it does get them depressed. from the amount of gayss i have befrended the suicide rate is extreemly high, and self harm or attempted suicide is about 80% among them.
November 15th, 2006  
GI_JOEJK
 
 
There you go, what I was saying...

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/sto...50/bug_chasers

Are you sure you want guys like this in your foxhole?
November 15th, 2006  
bulldogg
 
 
I see a difference between being gay and being a queen. If the person is professional is there a reason to exclude them from service?