Fourth Generation Warfare

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fourthgen

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As a civilian i'd like to know if any soldiers have thought up an efective way to combat fourth generation warfare?
 
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Insurgency? How is it an army of professional soldiers is not cutting through rag-tag guerrilla type troops like butter?
 
fourthgen, nah, I dont think so... The US military are wonderful killers. But to actually win the war... They need something else.

And there is no "war"... As there is no enemy. These are not military forces fighting each others... It's the military of an empire slaughtering a part of mankind they cant deal with.
 
Insurgency as a way of waging war actually dates back to classical antiquity, and thus predates the so-called second and third generations as described by Fourth Generation War theorists. Insurgents, guerillas, and resistance fighters figured large in most of the wars fought during this period. Mao was certainly not the first, nor even the most important, theorist to articulate the virtues of insurgency, or Peoples war, as it was sometimes called. Clausewitz, for one, called it a “reality of the nineteenth century,” and provided some valuable insights into its nature. Insurgency did, after all help the American colonies win independence from the British crown and it nearly thwarted the ultimate Prusso-German victory over France in the War of 1870-71. It played an important role in the histories of many Latin America states and in Western Europe and the Soviet Union during World War II as well as enabling the emergence of Israel in the late 1940s.

Portraying changes in warfare in terms of “generations” implies that each one evolved directly from its predecessor, and, as per the natural progression of generations, eventually displaced it. So, gentlemen, you often get the answer if you look back in history. Fact is that the concept of insurgency is well known and we fight it quite effectively.
 
What's the point? When you attack people, they have to defend themselves.

You try to get better in fighting an insurgency, you try to master the complex and subtle aspects of this new battlefield... But why are you doing so? Why dont you learn that sometimes, you have to leave people alone. That you are not all powerful.

And it looks like there is two ways to fight against a counterinsurgency and in both, you lose the war. One is through genocide. You kill everybody that looks different and hope you can get them all...
And the other is a "hearts and minds BS approach"... And you will probably get your ass handed to you in this process because you already pissed off everybody before even thinking about trying a new strategy...

Tell the military geniuses that they need the will of the people to succeed. Respect the will of the people.

And Napoleon lost his teeth in Spain because of that. You can have the best fighting in the block... But if you are unfair, you will just last a little longer than others.
 
If you started reading military history, you'd discovere that since 1945, the majority of the larger armies of the world have spent more time in counterinsurgency warfare than in conventional forms of war.


It was you who answered: The US military are wonderful killers. But to actually win the war... They need something else.

I'm interested in knowing what it is! So what is it?

But no!

Smoke, nothing but smoke!
 
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You didnt ask.

What they need is credibility. They dont have any. When they say that they are there to help, you cant help but say "yeah sure you do..."

Then, a social, economic, politic program... All they are selling is a retarded version of democracy mixed with capitalism inside a big imperialist agenda...

Then, to implement these programs, they will need "vision". This means a lot of wisdom and skills... We have a lot of technical skills... But wise people are a crushed minority in our countries. Price of democracy I guess...

And that's it. These conflicts started because of Western arrogance. Not Ben Laden, not Saddam, not Kaddafi, not the Palestinians...
Just normal human beings striking back with whatever they have...

All this war against terrorism is only a poor attempt to save a sinking savage and violent empire...

Through history we saw huge empires rise to power and get crushed after that... Is it so hard to think that it will happen to the US? It happened to the Brits... They were a huge empire and today they are the lapdog running behind the US war machine...

Rich and powerful people cant help but abuse their power... And weak and poor people cant help but resort to crime to survive...
Human nature buddy. If you think that you can master your destiny, then you are out of your mind... You can get better odds, but that's about it. Sooner or later, you will fail.

Good luck writing a book about how to deal with an insurgency... I'm sure that your bright minds can do it... Just dont forget that right now, you cant even make a doctrine to deal with corruption in your own country.
 
GHR said:
If you started reading military history, you'd discovere that since 1945, the majority of the larger armies of the world have spent more time in counterinsurgency warfare than in conventional forms of war.


It was you who answered: The US military are wonderful killers. But to actually win the war... They need something else.

I'm interested in knowing what it is! So what is it?

But no!

Smoke, nothing but smoke!
Click to expand...

GHR don´t encourage the troll..He has nothing of value to bring to the table..

The book has been written over and over..We are just not good at reading it.
Operation Storm is a brilliant account on a successful counter insurgency campaign.
And these guys have won several, they know their stuff.

OP ARTEMIS had some COIN stages as well IMHO.

KJ sends..
 
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GHR, I did notice. But remember Vietnam? They killed tons of guerrilla fighters... And still lost the war.

And you dont agree with me when I say that they are wonderful killers and that they needed something else to win the battle...

You dont want to understand...
 
KJ, You are right. But it's damn hard not to be provoked sometimes.

LeMask, Forget it. you will never understand.
 
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Well, I wasnt thinking the same, so forgive my ignorance if it's the case... Cant help myself... It makes sense in my mind and I dont understand how you dont see it too.
 
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