An examination of America's recent wars shows a similar trend. In Korea, Viet Nam, Iraq and Afghanistan the U.S. found itself fighting an enemy that was technically inferior by any measure. None of the aforementioned adversaries possessed navies or significant air forces, however, in spite of this were able to inflict profound casualties on U.S land forces. Part of the reason for this is that these wars were often fought on the enemies terms. An enemy who only has a rifle wants to fight you with his rifle. The U.S. would prefer to drop a bomb or napalm ( my personal favorite), on said enemy. In Iraq, U.S. Army Special Forces suffered severe casualties because SF operators were trained in CQB, wanted to use CGB tactics, but overlooked the fact that they were fighting guys who wanted to die, to get their 40 virgins. Guys who would fight in a building for while and when they saw they were losing would blow up the building. So, in future wars in the ME, like the one ramping up right now, I hope our leaders will as much as possible forego the use of ground troops and use stand-off weapons as much as possible. There are more of them than there are of us so I hope we will use industrial grade pesticide on them and I personally don't care what it is, nuclear weapons, nerve gas; whatever it takes because we will have one chance and one chance only to finish the business. Say, you wouldn't call me an extremist would you?

This talk is esoteric. As I explained earlier we could reduce ISIS offensive capabilities with bombing. Heavy strategic bombing of military hardware using the guidance of AWAKs radar. B-52's for known ISIS bases basically blowing the bases sky high. This would effectively cripple ISIS. Unfortunately some civilians that are in the ISIS umbrella would get caught in the crosshairs but this would stop the ISIS military advancement cold.

This is not Vietnam where they would be randomly bombing jungles hoping to hit the target or Afghanistan where they are trying to bomb relatively small groups of terrorist hiding in remote mountainous crags.

A characteristic of so-called "unconventional warfare" is getting someone else, a proxy, to do your fighting for you. It doesn't matter whether it is Syrian Arab Army, Kurds, Turks; anybody will do as long as it doesn't involve U.S. troops. This sounds cynical, but the parties mentioned have reasons of their own for wanting to fight. It requires care to make sure that you don't create a new, more dangerous enemy and none of the parties mentioned should be trusted, especially the Kurds. The U.S. has a lot of history with the Kurds. The U.S. has double-crossed them and been double-crossed by them at least a couple of times. In this war there are no good guys.

But my point is ISIS really can't hide so we could bomb the crap out of them. Thus diminishing their war making capabilities with little to no loss of American lives. With Awaks radar they can pinpoint any hardware and destroy it. Then bomb the whole camp to kingdom come with B-52's. Whoever wants to clean up what's left fine.
The key is to use the airbases bases next door in Turkey so they can really give it the bombing that's needed. Not just having a couple of planes fly in from way over in the Gulf

My thoughts on this are that we're trying to fight like a professional Army, whereas they are using guerilla tactics. It's funny that now that America has a sizable military to be reckoned with, we're stuck jumping from building to building to flush out hiders. Whereas two hundred years ago, when we were on the other side of this coin, we were the guerillas fighting the professional Army. Warfare, while it's tools may change, doesn't change all that much over the years. If we want to succeed against an enemy using guerilla tactics, we have to stop fighting like professionals.

But that's the thing. They are using conventional tactics in their desert war of conquer and occupation. Not so much guerilla tactics. They are attacking with tanks, artillery, etc. Also their bases are not easy to hide being in the open desert. These are the exact reasons that the US can minimize this treat with a heavy sustained bombing campaign from say nearby Turkey. People don't seem to understand the capabilities of the modern US air force.

Originally Posted by JOC

But that's the thing. They are using conventional tactics in their desert war of conquer and occupation. Not so much guerilla tactics. They are attacking with tanks, artillery, etc. Also their bases are not easy to hide being in the open desert. These are the exact reasons that the US can minimize this treat with a heavy sustained bombing campaign from say nearby Turkey. People don't seem to understand the capabilities of the modern US air force.

Their bases are either extremely well camouflaged or they are hidden in population centers. The fighting is also very much in the population centers which makes it extremely difficult to pinpoint who is who. Simply bombing them into oblivion isn't enough. Didn't work on the Germans or the Japanese... It isn't going to work on these guys either who have mastered the art of minimizing our ability to inflict massive damage to them. If there were tanks, armor, and infantry lined up in the desert, they would certainly be killed. It is more likely they are covered and then transported on a semi truck to the location where they are needed.

People also don't seem to understand the limitations of the Air Force also. They can certainly do damage...but they do much more damage in support of unified ground operation...something that isn't being conducted here.

Originally Posted by brinktk

Their bases are either extremely well camouflaged or they are hidden in population centers. The fighting is also very much in the population centers which makes it extremely difficult to pinpoint who is who. Simply bombing them into oblivion isn't enough. Didn't work on the Germans or the Japanese... It isn't going to work on these guys either who have mastered the art of minimizing our ability to inflict massive damage to them. If there were tanks, armor, and infantry lined up in the desert, they would certainly be killed. It is more likely they are covered and then transported on a semi truck to the location where they are needed.

People also don't seem to understand the limitations of the Air Force also. They can certainly do damage...but they do much more damage in support of unified ground operation...something that isn't being conducted here.

I didn't realize they were so well camouflaged. Of course you and I both know that we do have advanced systems for pinpointing enemy hardware. My thought was that being in the desert they would likely be more exposed, I guess I am wrong. However I still think the US can do more with bombing than they are doing presently.
We can't go back to WW2 where the USAAF or RAF would kill thousands of French or Italian civilians if the Germans were using the city or position as a strong point, i.e.: Caen, Monti Casino, etc.

The bad part about that is of course that sure we can pinpoint with incredible accuracy. However its a situation where your ordinary terrorist or what have you may live/work on activities in their home, where innocent civilians are. As a World power, we can't allow ourselves to disregard civilian lives.

Originally Posted by crazytanker

The bad part about that is of course that sure we can pinpoint with incredible accuracy. However its a situation where your ordinary terrorist or what have you may live/work on activities in their home, where innocent civilians are. As a World power, we can't allow ourselves to disregard civilian lives.

Remember we virtually eliminated all the Serbs heavy hardware without sending in troops. I mean they can detect a tank underneath a tarp using todays radars. It's very hard to hide the profile of this kind of hardware. And do it from such a high altitude that the enemy doesn't even know they are being mapped out for a bombing or missile run. You can minimize civilian deaths but can you omit them completely when the enemy hides amongst the civilians? This is quite different form the allied attack on Caen in WW2 where 40,000 French people died.