Mohmar Deathstrike
Banned
Darcia said:
Why is there no talk of Canada joining the EU?
EU Constitution rejected by France
Why is there no talk of Canada joining the EU?
Corocotta
Active member
gladius said:
Only extreme leftist(comunist) and extreme right(fascist, like Le Pen in France) political parties were agaisnt the Constituion. All other parties were favourable.
In Spain there was not a debate about the Constitution, all the political parties were favourable to it. In Spain we said yes to the Constitution, but only with a 40% participation....great failure!
I guess that most people are against this Constitution due to varied reasons, but basically these :
- We do not want Turkey in EU, the politicians do. Which would be next candidate...Israel?? may be Morocco?? :roll:
- In many counties the Constitution was approved by the parlaments...In a democratic country you should ask for the opinion of the people..this constitution is gonna be their fundamental law!
- Chauvinistic feelings
I agree with a unite Europe, but not like the one politicians want.
-
False ! there are no 54,87% people in France who are leftist or "fascist" ! About one half of the Socialist Party and the Green were against.
yep, but does everyone read the third part of this treaty ?
exactly
But another reason is also important : this constitution contained a political program, and this is not acceptable.
Corocotta
Active member
pierrot wrote
I was talking about political parties, not about the people. Conerning the "green" party...., just like the melons, green outside and dark red inside.
You said that the Constitution is not acceptable because it has a political program, what do you mean with that?
I was talking about political parties, not about the people. Conerning the "green" party...., just like the melons, green outside and dark red inside.
You said that the Constitution is not acceptable because it has a political program, what do you mean with that?
ninjafreak89
New Member
One of the main reason the people of European countries do not want a United Europe is because of the national aspirations embedded into the societies before the pre-WWI era. And now because of that (and many other political reasons), they are oppose to a united Europe because they fear that it will disrupt their identity as individual people of their states.
Mohmar Deathstrike
Banned
ninjafreak89 said:
Yeah, national identity is a weird useless thing. It may have been useful tool to mobilize the masses in the 1800s to create new states with a little more freedom than their predecessors, but there is no need for it now. I have some kind of NI but I can't explain why.
Mohmar Deathstrike
Banned
Darcia said:
Yes, but in France it represents "only" 35% of the "no-vote". The "no" won thanks to the left-wing electors, who were in a majority against the treaty.
They thought the treaty was too "liberal". But I must recognize this constitution was hazardous because it contained a "official" policy. Stauro, you can check it : read for example the third part (for example III-156, III-162, III-167 and the unbelievable III-131, but also the independence of the ECB, a parliament who cannot propose any law ! ... ) and the reference to the NATO (excuse me but it disturbs me :evil: )
The french paradox is : YES to Europe, so NO to this constitution
Well concerning the text itself you can read it here -->http://europa.eu.int/constitution/en/lsart3_en.htm
And look at the title of part III : do you really believe a constitution has to contain it ?
The reference to NATO is described at the article I-41--> http://europa.eu.int/constitution/en/lsart1_en.htm
NATO has nothing to do in a european constitution !
Hum I don't know if an other constitution will pass in France, but it is sure that if this new will not contain the third part, it would be easier. And perhaps I will vote "oui".
And look at the title of part III : do you really believe a constitution has to contain it ?
The reference to NATO is described at the article I-41--> http://europa.eu.int/constitution/en/lsart1_en.htm
NATO has nothing to do in a european constitution !
Hum I don't know if an other constitution will pass in France, but it is sure that if this new will not contain the third part, it would be easier. And perhaps I will vote "oui".
I guess the main reason for the French refusal was a domestic one, people are dissatisfied with Chirac's policy, the referendum was his project, so its failure is a personal failure for him and hence the shake-up of his cabinet.gladius said:
The other reason is that people in France and elsewhere (i.e. Germany) are afraid and angry about the new competition that comes with each act of extension and integration in/of the EU. The more the EU accretes, the easier it becomes i.e. for Renault to construct their cars in Slovakia and for Polish construction companies to win contracts in France and Germany.
So its actually the other way round, people are opposed to the aspects of liberalisation that come with the constitution.
And I dont see in general whats so socialist about the EU. I mean the EU is trying to regulate a lot of things, so if regulation is socialist by itself, ok. And there are subsidies, especially for agriculture, but that you will find everywhere in the world, in the US its called "USAid" if I remember correctly.
Corocotta
Active member
Darcia said:
We had a referendum. The main problem in Spain was that we did not have a real debate. All the political parties were pro Constitution, and this is quite strange `cause political parties usually do not agree on anything(if all the political parties agree somethig smells really bad). Only 40 % of spanish people voted, with this numbers you can get an idea of how much spaniards care about this Constitution.
CABAL
Active member
Actually this also bring concerns about Europe's Economy as well. According to BusinessWeek, Countries who opposed the EU Constitution experienced strong and rapid growth within their country as in contrast to the supporting nations who usually impose economic regulations mutually such as Italy and Germany experience an Economic slump.