Cdt Matteo
Active member
Dragon Skin is the best body armour in the world. Check it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KS0pSwdQfbY
Dragon Skin
FutureMedic
Active member
5.56X45mm
Milforum Mac Daddy
The problem with Dragon Skin is that the panels are defective against angled strikes. The Dragon Skin also weighs more then the Interceptor and does not provide enough protection from angled strikes.
The Interceptor provides more general overall protection then the Dragon Skin System. The Interceptor vest is made multiple companies. It is not made by one company. Point Blank Armor and Self Defense Industries are just two of the many companies that make them.
The Interceptor provides more general overall protection then the Dragon Skin System. The Interceptor vest is made multiple companies. It is not made by one company. Point Blank Armor and Self Defense Industries are just two of the many companies that make them.
Team Infidel
Forum Spin Doctor
I prefer the intercepter... more protection for the situation.
major liability
Active member
If they fixed the issues with the Dragon Skin I'd take it over Interceptor. That video where they unload 11 rounds into it with a FAL carbine at point blank and none penetrate is simply awesome. And that vid of the guy who got shot twice with a Dragunov and kept on running because the Dragon Skin stopped both rounds.
moving0target
Active member
http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,158645,00.html?ESRC=dod.nl
There are implications that the military is pulling similar crap with Dragonskin that they pulled with Stoner and his rifle. Anyone have an update on this?
There are implications that the military is pulling similar crap with Dragonskin that they pulled with Stoner and his rifle. Anyone have an update on this?
Here is a paper I wrote for school on this subject.
No matter if you are Republican or Democrat, liberal or conservative, for or against the war in Iraq. If you care the least bit about the United States of America and consider yourself in anyway patriotic then this is a report you must read. It addresses a much over looked issue in military equipment that has proved its worth in modern warfare: body armor. It can mean the deference between life and death. Today we are going to examine something that a huge debate among the armed forces service personal, their families and the nation. Despite all this debate about Interceptor (the current military issued body armor) and Dragon Skin (a genius design from Pinnacle Armor) you may have missed it and not know anything about it. Let me take some time to enlighten the public.
The military banned Dragon Skin which was developed by Pinnacle in 2003. Interceptor was developed by the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency) which is a subdivisiion of the Department of Defense. The Dragon Skin has proven vastly superior to the Interceptor. However the military issued a ban on Dragon Skin months BEFORE they tested it. According to the military Dragon Skin failed to measure up to standards, But every other test has proven Dragon Skin is very much better. Elite Military units such as Delta Force and SEAL Team Six (DEVGRU) and other SOF units wear them as well as CIA operators.
Interceptor uses four ceraminic plates one over the other to stop enemy fire. Sure it can soak up something like four rifle rounds but after that you just have 16.4 lbs of broken up metal plates to carry around as you get cut to pieces by 7.62x39mm rounds or maybe 7.62x54mm rounds depending on if or if not the soldier or marine has a sniper or a Machine Gunner pouring rounds down the street at them. Army doctrine states the the body armor our soldiers and marines are wearing should be enough to stop the rounds their primanry weapons fires. The issue here is that the 5.56mm that the M16/M4 fires is has much less AP (Armor Piercing) and stopping power are considerably weaker than the 7.62 rounds fired by the AK-47 and other Soviet and Eastern Bloc weapons. Dragon Skin however can and has stopped 40 7.62mm rounds. Legend has it Dragon Skin took 150 9mm rounds 60 5.56mm rounds and 30 7.62mm rounds took a barrage of fire from small arms. The Army says Dragon Skin failed but it has been tested by the following:
Mail Call (History Channel)
Future Weapons (Discovery Channel)
Fresno, CA police department
Dr. Gary Roberts, LCDR, USNR, Stanford University Medical Center
NBC News
And it pasted each of these tests with flying colors. The Department of Defense simply does not want to admit that Pinnacle has completely and utter out done them. After the test above proved them wrong the Pentagon switiched its anti Dragon Skin campaign to claim it was 20 lbs heavier than the interceptor and thus “too heavy”. Many people who have worn both Interceptor and Dragon Skin have said that it is much lighter than the Interceptor, Interestingly enough one US Army soldier I spoke with said the Interceptor was much too heavy for his tastes and often would not wear it. I could see where he is coming from. Dragon Skin using “Scales” the are silver dollar sized pieces that fit together like Medieval Chainmill armor. Four big plates have got to be much heavier than say 200 silver dollar sized scales.
The makers of Interceptor - Point Blank Body Armor along with 5 other contracters has a contract with the Department of Defense. It is clearly just a big budget scam so Jorge’s (George W Bush the president) cronies can make money. He has a multi-million dollar contract signed with them. Money talks especially when your dealing with a money hungry man like Jorge. He has made horrorble choices in the past regarding the military. While the invasion of Iraq was a good strategic move all in all (gave us a staging ground right in the center of the Middle East and the second biggest oil drum in the world. It was a poorly executed plan in which we passed big weapons cashes right by on the road to Baghdad. I personally think that the government and Pentagon wanted to show the American public and the world just how fast we could dash across the deserts of Iraq and crush the massive but poorly equiped, trained and led Iraqi Army. Destroying large military formations of arabs has proven very easy for a 1st world westernized nation to do as has been proven by the Israelis in their various wars against the Arab League. Basically all Jorge did was restate the obvious… again… We are the most wealthy country on the face of this god forsaken earth. The government should be able to provide our troops with THE best and nothing less. And we should do no less. The problem is that this country is run by rich businessmen. This whole issue goes way back… Does anyone remember the issue with the humvee armor? The humvees didn’t have good enough armored plating thus making our troops vurable to RPG and small arms fire. A improvised solution known as “Hillbilly Armor” was born as a result of the defenantacies in armored plating.
While Interceptor passed the military’s standards. Dragon Skin exceeded them. It went against rounds so powerful that the military did not require body armor to stop and it stopped the large caliber rounds cold. Dragon Skin is a real breakthrough in the design of body armor and armor in general. I believe that if soliders and marines were allowed to equipe themselves we would be much better off. We do need to expand the militaries arensel a bit. There are those who are looking for a replacement for the M16/M4 series of weapons. It is clear a replacement is needed yet… but what the military does need to is to expand our aresnel of serivce rifles/pistols. The military should adopt the German G36 and Israeli Galil the M1911A1 pistol should be reinstated and the USP (another 45. caliber hangun) should be introduced. Thus giving the military personal a more versital aresenal to work with. A versital supply of tools makes the tool kit better always. The only real disadvantage to have so many types of small arms is that the have to get separate training and spair parts for each type of weapon you have out on the field of battle. But the top brass doesn’t seem to agree with the idea of verieslity for reasons uknown to the rest of mankind. Dragon Skin is by far the best body armor in the world. There are other types of body armor which have proven impressive (more so than interceptor) but none can match Dragon Skin. The military seems to make a lot of stupid choices when it comes to combat gear. First off they thought about getting putting the XM29 into service. It was a big rifle with a lot of gadgets and gizmos. The 20mm grenade launcher had a six round magazine which was very impressive along with other very impressive features… only one very small problem. The weapon system was much too heavy. It weighed at least 20 pounds! That is a insane amount of weight to be carrying around when your being shot at. But then again why doesn’t the military just issue its personal with artillery pieces and Vulcan Cannons? The service personal in questio would have a ton of firepower but they would have a little trouble moving around... get the point? Weight didn’t seem to be a problem before so why is it a problem now? Plus everyone who has acutally worn Dragon Skin has said it was much lighter than the current body armor issued by the military which is interceptor.
No matter if you are Republican or Democrat, liberal or conservative, for or against the war in Iraq. If you care the least bit about the United States of America and consider yourself in anyway patriotic then this is a report you must read. It addresses a much over looked issue in military equipment that has proved its worth in modern warfare: body armor. It can mean the deference between life and death. Today we are going to examine something that a huge debate among the armed forces service personal, their families and the nation. Despite all this debate about Interceptor (the current military issued body armor) and Dragon Skin (a genius design from Pinnacle Armor) you may have missed it and not know anything about it. Let me take some time to enlighten the public.
The military banned Dragon Skin which was developed by Pinnacle in 2003. Interceptor was developed by the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency) which is a subdivisiion of the Department of Defense. The Dragon Skin has proven vastly superior to the Interceptor. However the military issued a ban on Dragon Skin months BEFORE they tested it. According to the military Dragon Skin failed to measure up to standards, But every other test has proven Dragon Skin is very much better. Elite Military units such as Delta Force and SEAL Team Six (DEVGRU) and other SOF units wear them as well as CIA operators.
Interceptor uses four ceraminic plates one over the other to stop enemy fire. Sure it can soak up something like four rifle rounds but after that you just have 16.4 lbs of broken up metal plates to carry around as you get cut to pieces by 7.62x39mm rounds or maybe 7.62x54mm rounds depending on if or if not the soldier or marine has a sniper or a Machine Gunner pouring rounds down the street at them. Army doctrine states the the body armor our soldiers and marines are wearing should be enough to stop the rounds their primanry weapons fires. The issue here is that the 5.56mm that the M16/M4 fires is has much less AP (Armor Piercing) and stopping power are considerably weaker than the 7.62 rounds fired by the AK-47 and other Soviet and Eastern Bloc weapons. Dragon Skin however can and has stopped 40 7.62mm rounds. Legend has it Dragon Skin took 150 9mm rounds 60 5.56mm rounds and 30 7.62mm rounds took a barrage of fire from small arms. The Army says Dragon Skin failed but it has been tested by the following:
Mail Call (History Channel)
Future Weapons (Discovery Channel)
Fresno, CA police department
Dr. Gary Roberts, LCDR, USNR, Stanford University Medical Center
NBC News
And it pasted each of these tests with flying colors. The Department of Defense simply does not want to admit that Pinnacle has completely and utter out done them. After the test above proved them wrong the Pentagon switiched its anti Dragon Skin campaign to claim it was 20 lbs heavier than the interceptor and thus “too heavy”. Many people who have worn both Interceptor and Dragon Skin have said that it is much lighter than the Interceptor, Interestingly enough one US Army soldier I spoke with said the Interceptor was much too heavy for his tastes and often would not wear it. I could see where he is coming from. Dragon Skin using “Scales” the are silver dollar sized pieces that fit together like Medieval Chainmill armor. Four big plates have got to be much heavier than say 200 silver dollar sized scales.
The makers of Interceptor - Point Blank Body Armor along with 5 other contracters has a contract with the Department of Defense. It is clearly just a big budget scam so Jorge’s (George W Bush the president) cronies can make money. He has a multi-million dollar contract signed with them. Money talks especially when your dealing with a money hungry man like Jorge. He has made horrorble choices in the past regarding the military. While the invasion of Iraq was a good strategic move all in all (gave us a staging ground right in the center of the Middle East and the second biggest oil drum in the world. It was a poorly executed plan in which we passed big weapons cashes right by on the road to Baghdad. I personally think that the government and Pentagon wanted to show the American public and the world just how fast we could dash across the deserts of Iraq and crush the massive but poorly equiped, trained and led Iraqi Army. Destroying large military formations of arabs has proven very easy for a 1st world westernized nation to do as has been proven by the Israelis in their various wars against the Arab League. Basically all Jorge did was restate the obvious… again… We are the most wealthy country on the face of this god forsaken earth. The government should be able to provide our troops with THE best and nothing less. And we should do no less. The problem is that this country is run by rich businessmen. This whole issue goes way back… Does anyone remember the issue with the humvee armor? The humvees didn’t have good enough armored plating thus making our troops vurable to RPG and small arms fire. A improvised solution known as “Hillbilly Armor” was born as a result of the defenantacies in armored plating.
While Interceptor passed the military’s standards. Dragon Skin exceeded them. It went against rounds so powerful that the military did not require body armor to stop and it stopped the large caliber rounds cold. Dragon Skin is a real breakthrough in the design of body armor and armor in general. I believe that if soliders and marines were allowed to equipe themselves we would be much better off. We do need to expand the militaries arensel a bit. There are those who are looking for a replacement for the M16/M4 series of weapons. It is clear a replacement is needed yet… but what the military does need to is to expand our aresnel of serivce rifles/pistols. The military should adopt the German G36 and Israeli Galil the M1911A1 pistol should be reinstated and the USP (another 45. caliber hangun) should be introduced. Thus giving the military personal a more versital aresenal to work with. A versital supply of tools makes the tool kit better always. The only real disadvantage to have so many types of small arms is that the have to get separate training and spair parts for each type of weapon you have out on the field of battle. But the top brass doesn’t seem to agree with the idea of verieslity for reasons uknown to the rest of mankind. Dragon Skin is by far the best body armor in the world. There are other types of body armor which have proven impressive (more so than interceptor) but none can match Dragon Skin. The military seems to make a lot of stupid choices when it comes to combat gear. First off they thought about getting putting the XM29 into service. It was a big rifle with a lot of gadgets and gizmos. The 20mm grenade launcher had a six round magazine which was very impressive along with other very impressive features… only one very small problem. The weapon system was much too heavy. It weighed at least 20 pounds! That is a insane amount of weight to be carrying around when your being shot at. But then again why doesn’t the military just issue its personal with artillery pieces and Vulcan Cannons? The service personal in questio would have a ton of firepower but they would have a little trouble moving around... get the point? Weight didn’t seem to be a problem before so why is it a problem now? Plus everyone who has acutally worn Dragon Skin has said it was much lighter than the current body armor issued by the military which is interceptor.
Putting it bluntly the whole body armor issue among countless other issues relating to things regarding the military is WAY out of control. Sometime needs to be done to bring reason and sanity back to the armed services of the United States of America. The military banned Dragon Skin warning our troops of “serious injury or death” may result because of the supposed “weakness” of Dragon Skin. Now Dragon Skin may be more expensive than interceptor so it just may (although very unlikely seeing as how we have the largest and richest economy in the world) be impossible to issue the body armor to ALL the troops. But they should at least be issued to spec ops (as they often are) and to Support Gunners who often take the bulk of the fire. Support Gunners carry big ass LMGs (Light Machine Guns) like the M249 SAW (Squad Automatic Weapon) and as a result receive a lot of fire in return, much like Newton’s third law of motion “for every action there is a equal but opposite reaction.” Newton’s laws appear to apply in combat and other aspects of life. And a lot of soldiers and marines appear to be buying Dragon Skin.
A single interceptor body armor costs 1000 USD. A Aircraft Carrier costs around 13.7 Billion USD where as it would take AT MOST 2 billion USD to requipe our entire force both Active and Reserve with Dragon Skin. This would be a real good move and a real cost effective one in the long run. We could take all the interceptors and turn them over to the New Iraqi Army and Afghan National Army both of which have servere equipment defianacies. Using these old interceptors to equip our new allies in Iraq and Afghanistan would prove useful to making them more effective on the battlefield.
We have a lot of junk laying around in our armories across the country our former Warsaw Pact nation have a lot of old Soviet junk they could just dumb there old gear they got from the USSR during the Cold War days. I say we should also give the New Iraqi Army and Afghan National Army a company of M1A1 Abrams MBTs (Main Battle Tanks) per division. Having studied the Korean War I noted how poorly the ROKs (Republic of Korea) military was equiped in poor contrast to the NKPA (North Korean People’s Army) as a result the US troops in the region as well as the ROK were thrown off balance as a result and pushed into the Pusan Preimier that was until Douglas MacArthur deployed the 1st Marine Division to land at Inch’on in a awesome master stroke which really saved everything. With Iran at the border hoping to annex Iraq and turn itself into a Shia Empire and genocide the Sunnis. I say the military should make them strong enough to repell a attack by Iran but don’t make them strong enough to attack Israel. We need to give the The New Iraqi Army and the Afghan National Army enough weapons to defend themselves and aid us in a attack against Iran, Who knows they may end up like Jordan and become a Arab ally of Israel. It is possible for a Arab State to befriend Israel contray to popular belief.
Now lets get back to the Dragon Skin ban. The families Soldiers and Marines will be disqualifed from receiving life insurance from the military if they are killed in action. I don’t see what kind of threat this is supposed to be… At least I do have kids and that is pretty much written in stone (unless of course me and some other girl around here get together and change that). My parents can take care of and provide for themselves and I doubt I will ever have children or get married. This all matters to me because I intend to join up and serve in the military. I surely hope the military takes the following ideas I listed above into consideration.
They (the military) have said that Dragon Skin can’t take angled shots because of the scale like structure claiming they slip through. This may hold some water but why should I believe them? Everything they have said so far has been proven to be a lie. The scales are held together by some type of glue that I know nothing about other than its there. This has so far been the only argument that has held any water thus far. But then again if Dragon Skin wasn’t truly better than interceptor why would they issue them to spec ops personal? A Army colonel named John Norwood flucked Dragon Skin at the testing the military proformed. A month later he left the Army to go work for a company that made interceptor under a 350 million dollar contract.
If anyone can prove to me that interceptor is truly better than Dragon Skin I will gladly eat my words. Until then I will contiune to say the military doesn’t like the fact it was outdone. There are a ton of issues that need to be looked into and I have addressed all of them as best I can. So this will be the end of my paper…
THE END.
A single interceptor body armor costs 1000 USD. A Aircraft Carrier costs around 13.7 Billion USD where as it would take AT MOST 2 billion USD to requipe our entire force both Active and Reserve with Dragon Skin. This would be a real good move and a real cost effective one in the long run. We could take all the interceptors and turn them over to the New Iraqi Army and Afghan National Army both of which have servere equipment defianacies. Using these old interceptors to equip our new allies in Iraq and Afghanistan would prove useful to making them more effective on the battlefield.
We have a lot of junk laying around in our armories across the country our former Warsaw Pact nation have a lot of old Soviet junk they could just dumb there old gear they got from the USSR during the Cold War days. I say we should also give the New Iraqi Army and Afghan National Army a company of M1A1 Abrams MBTs (Main Battle Tanks) per division. Having studied the Korean War I noted how poorly the ROKs (Republic of Korea) military was equiped in poor contrast to the NKPA (North Korean People’s Army) as a result the US troops in the region as well as the ROK were thrown off balance as a result and pushed into the Pusan Preimier that was until Douglas MacArthur deployed the 1st Marine Division to land at Inch’on in a awesome master stroke which really saved everything. With Iran at the border hoping to annex Iraq and turn itself into a Shia Empire and genocide the Sunnis. I say the military should make them strong enough to repell a attack by Iran but don’t make them strong enough to attack Israel. We need to give the The New Iraqi Army and the Afghan National Army enough weapons to defend themselves and aid us in a attack against Iran, Who knows they may end up like Jordan and become a Arab ally of Israel. It is possible for a Arab State to befriend Israel contray to popular belief.
Now lets get back to the Dragon Skin ban. The families Soldiers and Marines will be disqualifed from receiving life insurance from the military if they are killed in action. I don’t see what kind of threat this is supposed to be… At least I do have kids and that is pretty much written in stone (unless of course me and some other girl around here get together and change that). My parents can take care of and provide for themselves and I doubt I will ever have children or get married. This all matters to me because I intend to join up and serve in the military. I surely hope the military takes the following ideas I listed above into consideration.
They (the military) have said that Dragon Skin can’t take angled shots because of the scale like structure claiming they slip through. This may hold some water but why should I believe them? Everything they have said so far has been proven to be a lie. The scales are held together by some type of glue that I know nothing about other than its there. This has so far been the only argument that has held any water thus far. But then again if Dragon Skin wasn’t truly better than interceptor why would they issue them to spec ops personal? A Army colonel named John Norwood flucked Dragon Skin at the testing the military proformed. A month later he left the Army to go work for a company that made interceptor under a 350 million dollar contract.
If anyone can prove to me that interceptor is truly better than Dragon Skin I will gladly eat my words. Until then I will contiune to say the military doesn’t like the fact it was outdone. There are a ton of issues that need to be looked into and I have addressed all of them as best I can. So this will be the end of my paper…
THE END.
A Can of Man
Je suis aware
My pick is what the pros pick.
i think the main issue with dragon skin is that is vulnerable to ricochets that may bounce off the ground and come up in between the plates. If i recall correctly, it is also much heavier than the interceptor armor which you prob wouldnt want to be carrying around in the 110 degree heat.
Many who have worn both Interceptor and Dragon Skin have said Dragon Skin is much lighter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy-8
Many who have worn both Interceptor and Dragon Skin have said Dragon Skin is much lighter.
"The other problem for Dragon Skin is weight: It is about 20 pounds heavier than the 28 pound Interceptor Armor."
From here: http://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/478-3450.aspx
The Dragon Skin, he said, weighs 47.5 pounds, compared to the Army-issued Interceptor armor, which weighs 28 pounds.
From here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18790506/
Originally Posted by Easy-8
Many who have worn both Interceptor and Dragon Skin have said Dragon Skin is much lighter.
"The other problem for Dragon Skin is weight: It is about 20 pounds heavier than the 28 pound Interceptor Armor."
From here: http://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/478-3450.aspx
The Dragon Skin, he said, weighs 47.5 pounds, compared to the Army-issued Interceptor armor, which weighs 28 pounds.
From here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18790506/
Last edited:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy-8
Many who have worn both Interceptor and Dragon Skin have said Dragon Skin is much lighter.
"The other problem for Dragon Skin is weight: It is about 20 pounds heavier than the 28 pound Interceptor Armor."
From here: http://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/478-3450.aspx
The Dragon Skin, he said, weighs 47.5 pounds, compared to the Army-issued Interceptor armor, which weighs 28 pounds.
From here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18790506/
I have spoken with and heard them on the news and they say it was lighter. Their words not mine.
major liability
Active member
Even if it is heavier, I know I'd want the best protection I could get if I was entering a building with a lot of angry bad guys with Kalashnikovs pointed at the door. I guess the only way to know if Dragon Skin really works is to compare it side-by-side with Interceptor, but I don't know any civilians rich enough to do that.
FULLMETALJACKET
MilForum Bad Apple
nice, i heard an Army individual talking about this some months back, it looks like it works well, but nothing in this world is flawless.