Has anybody mentioned it was a plea bargain after two days of testimony?

Originally Posted by 03USMC

Has anybody mentioned it was a plea bargain after two days of testimony?

Nope. Some people had other interests...

Originally Posted by captiva303

Nope. Some people had other interests...

And others just saw it as a blatant whitewash, or cop out, call it as you will. I'm told that any excuse is supposedly better than none,... that is if it is even remotely credible, and that's where this case seems to fall on it's @rse.

Originally Posted by BritinAfrica

Looks like we're in for another marathon.

Why, do you feel that the obvious truth should be ignored and just let slide for the sake of convenience?

Originally Posted by senojekips

Why, do you feel that the obvious truth should be ignored and just let slide for the sake of convenience?

No mate, just an observation. Fill your boots.

We can all argue one way or another until we are all blue in the face, but is it going to change the outcome? Will it prevent it happening again? I have no real idea but I doubt it.

18 year old Derek Bentley was hanged who had the mind of a 12 year old, all the arguments in the world that the death sentence was wrong in this case are not going to bring the poor bugger back again.

Originally Posted by BritinAfrica

No mate, just an observation. Fill your boots.

We can all argue one way or another until we are all blue in the face, but is it going to change the outcome? Will it prevent it happening again? I have no real idea but I doubt it.

18 year old Derek Bentley was hanged who had the mind of a 12 year old, all the arguments in the world that the death sentence was wrong in this case are not going to bring the poor bugger back again.

Some of us just have an aversion to those who would gladly sweep the truth under the rug for the sake of having a quiet time, regardless of the poor bastards who copped it in the neck, and I don't give a damn if they were camel jockeys, Wall Street executives or failed Presbyterians, the concern is, that the offence was committed in "our" name, the guys who continually allege that we are "better" than they are. Then we whine because we have no credibility among those we try to deal with in world affairs.

You yourself stated that Derek Bentley was apparently hung without due consideration of the facts, so obviously you care? The fact that it can't be reversed is null and void,... but you don't forget it. Other people in this world have long memories too...

Some people don't, because they are too bloody self centred and morally bankrupt to stand up for that which is right. It all comes down to basic honesty to yourself and having a bit of self respect.

Originally Posted by senojekips

Some of us just have an aversion to those who would gladly sweep the truth under the rug for the sake of having a quiet time, regardless of the poor bastards who copped it in the neck, and I don't give a damn if they were camel jockeys, Wall Street executives or failed Presbyterians, the concern is, that the offence was committed in "our" name, the guys who continually allege that we are "better" than they are. Then we whine because we have no credibility among those we try to deal with in world affairs.

You yourself stated that Derek Bentley was apparently hung without due consideration of the facts, so obviously you care? The fact that it can't be reversed is null and void,... but you don't forget it. Other people in this world have long memories too...

Some people don't, because they are too bloody self centred and morally bankrupt to stand up for that which is right. It all comes down to basic honesty to yourself and having a bit of self respect.

Hi Seno,

I have a question and ponder it. I do not defend what these Marines did nor other atrocities committed in Afghanistan and in Iraq. The truth? What is the truth? In this case, the killings of the civilians in Haditha, the documentation is so bad, even from the yellow media, which normally is bad, because they want to sell the "news". Yes, sometimes we do not have choice than to use this "what the dog dragged in news". Here is my question; are the facts here your facts or your interpretation of the facts? The Haditha was a tragedy, what really happened there is not known. It has not been an independent investigation of this tragic incident.

Originally Posted by Ghostrider

Hi Seno,

I have a question and ponder it. I do not defend what these Marines did nor other atrocities committed in Afghanistan and in Iraq. The truth? What is the truth? In this case, the killings of the civilians in Haditha, the documentation is so bad, even from the yellow media, which normally is bad, because they want to sell the "news". Yes, sometimes we do not have choice than to use this "what the dog dragged in news". Here is my question; are the facts here your facts or your interpretation of the facts? The Haditha was a tragedy, what really happened there is not known. It has not been an independent investigation of this tragic incident.

I think that what happened is known, and it is being obfuscated by people, who like Holocaust deniers and 9/11 conspiracy theorists have some second agenda, which is not too hard to work out in this case.

For people with no second agenda it's pretty much open and shut as it would have been had these same offenders been Muslims, Chinese or Somalians.

Originally Posted by senojekips

I think that what happened is known, and it is being obfuscated by people, who like Holocaust deniers and 9/11 conspiracy theorists have some second agenda, which is not too hard to work out in this case.

For people with no second agenda it's pretty much open and shut as it would have been had these same offenders been Muslims, Chinese or Somalians.

You think, therefore you are? , there are no facts, only the interpretation of the facts. You are not answering my question.

Originally Posted by Ghostrider

You think, therefore you are? , there are no facts, only the interpretation of the facts. You are not answering my question.

I certainly answered it, but obviously you don't wish to accept it because it never got the answer you wanted. That's the sad thing about the truth, it's not always what you wish to hear.

The truth?.... The truth is what remains when the lies have been uncovered, and discounted.

There are plenty of facts, and there is a lot of evidence, but the evidence in this case often flies in the face of the visible facts. This is generally what happens when those giving evidence are clearly not telling the truth. For some reason known only unto themselves, those sitting in judgment seemed completely unaware of this, and instead of pursuing these anomalies felt that it may be more to their advantage to provide a backdoor for the accused to save a lot of embarrassment.

If anything the judgment itself raises far more questions than it answered.

Originally Posted by Ghostrider

Hi Seno,

I have a question and ponder it. I do not defend what these Marines did nor other atrocities committed in Afghanistan and in Iraq. The truth? What is the truth? In this case, the killings of the civilians in Haditha, the documentation is so bad, even from the yellow media, which normally is bad, because they want to sell the "news". Yes, sometimes we do not have choice than to use this "what the dog dragged in news". Here is my question; are the facts here your facts or your interpretation of the facts? The Haditha was a tragedy, what really happened there is not known. It has not been an independent investigation of this tragic incident.

Ok lets look at the bare bones, no media hype, no interpretations.
- Were 24 people killed in this incident?
- Were any of them combatants?
- Were any of them supporting combatants?
- Was there any justifiable reason these people are dead?

In my opinion the answers are:
- Yes
- No
- Unknown but not at the time.
- No.

So that leaves the question was it accidental (in other words wrong place, wrong time, panicking troops or "**** happens" type events) or was it is deliberate?

My personal opinion is that it was deliberate as a reprisal for the death of one of their own earlier, it wouldn't have mattered whether it was an orphanage or Saddam's bunker they went into the occupants were going to die.

But lets assume it was accidental, in your opinion does accidentally killing 24 innocent people warrant no punishment?