Could Germany have defeated Russia?




 
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June 3rd, 2017  
MontyB
 
 

Topic: Could Germany have defeated Russia?


I doubt anyone out there would argue that in 1941 the German military was not the best in the field but did it have what it took to defeat Russia or was it just too big to be beaten.

There are cases to be made about poor decisions, racial ideologies that drove huge numbers into partisan activities and general incompetence within the German infrastructure that were exposed by a protracted war.

But perhaps the Soviet Union was just too much for them.
June 9th, 2017  
George
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
But perhaps the Soviet Union was just too much for them.
Probably, considering their manpower & willingness to withdraw as far as needed to stretch the Germans out.
June 19th, 2017  
Hutchie
 
Don't think so. About as much of a chance as Japan would have had invading the USA. Russia was too big and they had too many soldiers. Germany was ill equipped to fight in the Russian winter and perhaps Germany's weakest link was Adolph Hitler. Of course Uncle Joe probably killed more Russians than the Germans. 4 countries not to invade IMHO #1 Russia , #2 USA #3 Switzerland and #4 China, though the Japanese did a fair job trying.
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June 20th, 2017  
George
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutchie
4 countries not to invade IMHO #1 Russia , #2 USA #3 Switzerland and #4 China, though the Japanese did a fair job trying.
Japs were winning in China most of the War.
August 19th, 2017  
lljadw
 
[QUOTE=Hutchie;705420Germany was ill equipped to fight in the Russian winter

and perhaps Germany's weakest link was Adolph Hitler.


Of course Uncle Joe probably killed more Russians than the Germans. [/QUOTE]

1) NO

2 ) NO

3 ) Irrelevant and wrong
August 20th, 2017  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutchie
Germany was ill equipped to fight in the Russian winter and perhaps Germany's weakest link was Adolph Hitler.
The funny thing is that I keep reading German reports that they were equipped to fight in the Russian winter what they weren't prepared for was the difficulty in shifting material to the front.

For example the Winter of 1941 German logistics had plenty of winter equipment but the amount they could ship east was so limited they had to decide whether to send winter equipment, supplies and munitions or reinforcements they didnt have the transport capacity to move all three at once consequently warehouses remained full of winter uniforms while troops at the front froze.
August 23rd, 2017  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
The funny thing is that I keep reading German reports that they were equipped to fight in the Russian winter what they weren't prepared for was the difficulty in shifting material to the front.

For example the Winter of 1941 German logistics had plenty of winter equipment but the amount they could ship east was so limited they had to decide whether to send winter equipment, supplies and munitions or reinforcements they didnt have the transport capacity to move all three at once consequently warehouses remained full of winter uniforms while troops at the front froze.
I have read similar things and that is an evidence of not being prepared for what the winter does to humans. It is tough to be out and about in the winter without winter clothes. The Germans also had problems with lubricants for their weapons and other equipment.
August 23rd, 2017  
Hutchie
 
I spent some time on the Korean DMZ in the early 1970's. I can tell you the US. Army didn't do a great job equipping me for winter. I never got any winter issue, nearly froze my butt off. Surely wouldn't have wanted to have been there during the war! Can only imagine, being in either the Russian or German Armies in the middle of a Russian winter.
August 23rd, 2017  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutchie
I spent some time on the Korean DMZ in the early 1970's. I can tell you the US. Army didn't do a great job equipping me for winter. I never got any winter issue, nearly froze my butt off. Surely wouldn't have wanted to have been there during the war! Can only imagine, being in either the Russian or German Armies in the middle of a Russian winter.
I served in the end of the 1980s and we were issued winter clothes. We had probably not survived without any winter clothes. I can also imagine how it had been during the war without any clothes suited for the cold temps.
August 23rd, 2017  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by I3BrigPvSk
I have read similar things and that is an evidence of not being prepared for what the winter does to humans. It is tough to be out and about in the winter without winter clothes. The Germans also had problems with lubricants for their weapons and other equipment.
I think people over rate the effect of the Russian winter, it is not like Germany in winter is a tropical paradise, Germans are well used to and equipped for cold weather.

Where the war in Russia fell over in my opinion is logistics but it was not a failing of German logistics units as their ability late in the war to ship units around to plug gaps proves their ability but rather a failure of German command to understand just how backward the transport infrastructure in Russia was at the time.
 


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