Civil Unions Vs Gay "marriage" thoughts? - Page 4




 
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Civil Unions Vs Gay "marriage" thoughts?
 
January 11th, 2008  
senojekips
 
 
Civil Unions Vs Gay "marriage" thoughts?
Quick, get help. I think Chief Bones is having one of his "Turns"

I beg the question in all seriousness, Why do you consider that straight "Married" couples were originally given the recognition in law that they enjoy? Now, I am talking purely about the recognition "in law" nothing to do with religion.
January 12th, 2008  
AZ_Infantry
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by senojekips
Regarding the question. Homosexual* partnerships should not be given formal recognition, any more than a business partnership or club membership, as this partnership plays no part in furthering the human race. (Yeah,... I know there are heterosexual couples that shouldn't be allowed to breed either) But that's another story.

I know many will disapprove, but I'm a man of my time, and see no future in this modern politically correct, "touchy feely" world.

I regard homosexuals* as living in a parallel universe. They are there,.... but they play no active part in my universe. Depending on the way in which they interact with others, they range from sometimes "brilliant" people to objects of utmost disgust,.... pretty much the same as some heterosexuals. I will treat them with civil courtesy but never regard them as part of my world.

*I use the word homosexual, because the term "Gay" is a misnomer introduced by them, to make their lifestyle appear less abnormal. It is meant to sound "fun" which to me it is certainly not.
THIS. Excellent post and explains my personal contentions well: That I won't bother them, they don't bother me, but they are useless to the species and, thus, marriage becomes a cover-word misnomer in the name of political correctness.

I am a man. Homosexuals don't threaten me because, frankly, they can't. What are they going to threaten? What DOES threaten me is them raising a perfectly normal child to be abnormal/dysfunctional, a problem I, as a parent, have with any parent that doesn't live for what's best for their children. The kids come first, and if your lifestyle instills within them things that are likely to have them ostracized then you, the parent, change. Stop drinking, stop smoking crack, get a better job, use money more wisely, move to another area, stop seeing other men.

Let them have their civil union is that's what they need to feel equal and yet special. But marriage is a biblical principal of a life-long commitment of love and child rearing between a man and a woman propagating the species - hopefully for the better.

As a society, we must be careful to keep equality equal. And yes, everyone has a right to equality, to the same pursuits of happiness as the rest of us. Where we go wrong and begin the slippery slope is when I, a straight, white, Christian man, apply for a job and that job is denied to me because someone somewhere said that position has to be filled with a woman, or a homosexual, or a black... You get the point.

This is the honorable intent of equality gone awry - where we've simply switched discrimination sides, not ended the discrimination (which should be everyone's goal). I think a civil union is an acceptable compromise for this particular fight for equality.
January 16th, 2008  
Missileer
 
 
Most of you folks have an eye-opening experience ahead of you if you desire to work for big industry. Our company has many programs set up by the leadership councils at every corporate level. These programs are company sponsored peer groups where different religions, races, colors, and lifestyles have regular meetings on such subjects as how to "fit in" or respect others as well as what is acceptable behavior in a corporate environment.

I stopped counting how many groups there are but one is the "gay, lesbian, transgender, and transsexual" organization. There are many orgs such as Pacific Islanders, African Americans, Latin Americans, Native Americans, Pacific Rim countries, several women's groups, Muslim groups, handicapped groups, and more being added.

At first, my thought was "why do they get a group and there are no white American males?" After attending several anti discrimination classes (several per year) as a part of our required training hours, I realized that the aim is to educate the minority represented as well as "normal" people as to how to work together as a team. There are no marches, banners, demands, or demonstrations of any kind by any employee, that's a firing offense, concerning their perceived rights.

When I worked on the parent research program for what was to become the eyes for the "Predator" the head project engineer was the president of the gay, lesbian, transsexual, transgender group. Good, cerebral, engineer who isn't "swishy" or any different, business wise, as anyone else on the team.

If you expect to have a career in most large defense companies, you have to readjust a few pre-conceived ideas about your co-workers and accept that you are all there to do the best job possible or hit the bricks.
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Civil Unions Vs Gay "marriage" thoughts?
January 16th, 2008  
mmarsh
 
 
My feeling are they same as most others, although for different reasons.

I see no reason to deny gays a civil-union and all the legal rights of a married couple.

As a 'marriage' however its trickier. The institute of Marriage is primary a religious ceremony. And well, just about every faith I can think of views homosexuality as a sin. At best its tolerated, and worst its a death sentence. Unless religion were willing to revise its views on the question (extremely unlikely) I think it would be hard to justify a 'marriage'. One thing is clear, society is not ready for gay marriage. I would advise the gay community not to press the issue on this. They are absolutly entitled to civil rights, but the right to get married isn't a civil right, its a religious ceremony.

One final point. Many people use the gay marriage issue as a platform for homophobia. I (and I believe most people here) simply oppose gay marriage on theoritical grounds, but there are some that use the issue to pass a message of hatred.
January 16th, 2008  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
These programs are company sponsored peer groups where different religions, races, colors, and lifestyles have regular meetings on such subjects as how to "fit in" or respect others as well as what is acceptable behavior in a corporate environment.
Hmmmm....

To me, this is exactly the type of Politically Correct clap trap that demonstrates it's own stupidity.

I fail to see how emphasizing peoples differences by pigeon holing them into their own little groups no matter what you say to them and others, makes them work better as a team. They may work better as a team of "one legged gay stamp collectors", but this does not integrate them into the group as a whole, which I thought was the whole purpose of the exercise.

All people within a company, or other working group should be treated as one homogeneous group, after all that is what a "team" is.

As for changing the views of their peers, that is also PC rubbish. I worked for some years with a bloke who was an avid horse racing fan, now,... I had absolutely no interest in this subject and he talked about it non stop. No amount of "training" or classes of any kind could make me interested in this subject and it is the same with all other self interest groups.

The above notwithstanding, I still respected the man as a human being, and we worked together very well. But,.... there was no way that I could possibly be made to empathise with the love of his life.

This is a perfect example of social engineering gone haywire.
January 16th, 2008  
Merew22
 
Simply throwing my two cents in as well:

The only reason that this distinction between a "civil union" and a "marriage" is an issue in the first place is the difference in benefits on both the federal and state level. Benefits for civil unions are outlined on a state to state basis and for that reason are all different, however, of course civil unions really have no benefits under the federal government. The gay community is pushing the issue because they want the same benefits that heterosexual marriages recognized by law receive. That is the issue- not religious beliefs. Like some a you have already stated, it doesn't really matter if it's a civil union or a marriage, (each religion has its own set of beliefs of course) but most view homosexuality as wrong anyway. It's all about the benefits and money involved. That's why some people would rather it be recognized as a marriage instead of a civil union.

Here's a place on about.com that outlines the differences in benefits if you are interested in finding out exactly what I'm referring to:

http://gaylife.about.com/od/samesexm...ilmarriage.htm


Military Girl
January 16th, 2008  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merew22
It's all about the benefits and money involved. That's why some people would rather it be recognized as a marriage instead of a civil union.

Military Girl
http://www.usamilitarymedals.com/ fan.
"We shall meanly lose or nobly save the last hope of earth." - Abraham Lincoln
I agree 100%.

That is why I feel that homosexual pairs should not be recognised in law as either "Marriages" or "Civil Unions". Straight couples receive benefits because they are "breeding" if you will, and thereby advancing our society, hopefully raising a new generation of workers and taxpayers.
January 17th, 2008  
03USMC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
Most of you folks have an eye-opening experience ahead of you if you desire to work for big industry. Our company has many programs set up by the leadership councils at every corporate level. These programs are company sponsored peer groups where different religions, races, colors, and lifestyles have regular meetings on such subjects as how to "fit in" or respect others as well as what is acceptable behavior in a corporate environment.

I stopped counting how many groups there are but one is the "gay, lesbian, transgender, and transsexual" organization. There are many orgs such as Pacific Islanders, African Americans, Latin Americans, Native Americans, Pacific Rim countries, several women's groups, Muslim groups, handicapped groups, and more being added.

At first, my thought was "why do they get a group and there are no white American males?" After attending several anti discrimination classes (several per year) as a part of our required training hours, I realized that the aim is to educate the minority represented as well as "normal" people as to how to work together as a team. There are no marches, banners, demands, or demonstrations of any kind by any employee, that's a firing offense, concerning their perceived rights.

When I worked on the parent research program for what was to become the eyes for the "Predator" the head project engineer was the president of the gay, lesbian, transsexual, transgender group. Good, cerebral, engineer who isn't "swishy" or any different, business wise, as anyone else on the team.

If you expect to have a career in most large defense companies, you have to readjust a few pre-conceived ideas about your co-workers and accept that you are all there to do the best job possible or hit the bricks.

Thats any job connected to the Gov IN ANYWAY. In 2 weeks I get to do my 16 hrs in "diversity training" to better understand and relate to ethnic/cultural/lifestyle groups which I may encounter. This years target group....Hispanics. No problemo
January 17th, 2008  
AZ_Infantry
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03USMC
Thats any job connected to the Gov IN ANYWAY. In 2 weeks I get to do my 16 hrs in "diversity training" to better understand and relate to ethnic/cultural/lifestyle groups which I may encounter. This years target group....Hispanics. No problemo
That should be an easy class.

"How to work with illegal aliens, 101:

Point to shovel, point to area you want dug, widen arms for depth..."

Sorry.
January 17th, 2008  
senojekips
 
 
I've got no beef with Hispanics, so long as they don't want their homosexual unions recognised in law.
 


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