China' army - Page 6




 
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Boots
 
January 6th, 2005  
gingerbeard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rocco
pretty simple... come to kmart... everything their is made in china. look at where computer chips and upper echelon of new tech is made?
japan, america, germany create the stronger products, and let china mass produce products that can be made cheaper.... china is chosen becuase of its better infrastructure.
look at which countries have R&D of the biggest firms like miscrosoft and cisco... countries like israel and US...
look which countries export weapons... which countries have bought chinas weps?
olympics? look which countries are top at REAL sports like boxing, wrestling, running...
152 mm turret? and? the T-72 had a 125mm turret, but got owned by 105mm turrets from merkava's...
china has some good missles to beat carriers, but this technology came from russia, as did the nuclear technology, with the exception of that taken from america by spies.

http://nobelprize.org/

find me 10 chinese winners? then go see how many americans won, or austrians, or jewish people, and compare their population %...
its all relevant...
yes you are correct, chinese students are smart, i fully agree with you, and they make for great doctors etc...but they only perform medical practices already in existence, not create new ones...
look at the most successful parts of china... hong kong? western influence... shanghai, western influence... taiwan is an economic powerhouse... why???

sure chinese invented paper, gunpower, whiskey, but this was hundreds ofyears ago, and the chinese didnt even know they invented it until western archeologists found the proof.

china is NOT a leader yet... like i said... in the future.
few things u have to consider, the chinese didnt join Olympics as early as US. and oh also, most US winner are Black! so u cannot really boast about ur nation, they are US citizen yes. but really u should boast about the african origin.
And also, china in the 70-80s doesnt have the funds to put into to train its Olympics representative. and also china viewed it wasnt important. until recently. and look at how many US won as the Olympics started, at least china in 20 years climbed to be the second top.

in fact, china was a very advance country, even more advance than the west till 1800, dun blieve me? go and find a 24 volume books called Needham's Science and civilation in China. written by a westerner this time so no bashing on "its a chinese propaganda" by some stupid people who doesnt even read its own sources then critizing. i've never read any chinese sources since i cant read chinese!

back to the topic, in fact sexybeast was right, but i think not anymore at this 21 century, the army today is less for internal purpose than it was before, in fact much less since they are preparing about taiwan and its ICBMS, with common sense, wouldnt target its own would it?!!?!?!?
and surely the aircrafts etc.. aint to use to rival its own rebels but US.

u got to know china is getting modernized very quickly, look at this source, and now tell me about china's technology, and also u got to think one thing on ur mind, how can 50 years ago they were farmers, today they are so much more different, then think about the future, china's technological pressure has just began......:

China Now Test-Flying Homemade AWACS
Radar Planes Intended For Use in Taiwan Strait

By Edward Cody
Washington Post Foreign Service
Saturday, November 13, 2004; Page A19

BEIJING, Nov. 12 -- The Chinese military, undeterred by a U.S. veto that blocked the purchase of Israeli planes, has developed its own radar surveillance aircraft and is test-flying the first models for early deployment in the Taiwan Strait, according to military specialists.

The Chinese airborne warning and control system, or AWACS, uses domestically produced advanced radar mounted on a Russian-made Il-76 transport aircraft. Analysts said the AWACS marks an important step in the government's campaign to develop the modern military necessary to back up its threat to reunite Taiwan with the mainland by force if necessary.

Electronic weaponry -- in this case, equipment to monitor the skies and control warplanes over a wide battlefield -- has been a major focus of extensive military improvements in recent years. In particular, AWACS has long been seen by the military as an indispensable tool for air superiority over the 100-mile strait separating Taiwan from the mainland.

"You've got to have those AWACS up there or you're not going anywhere," said a foreign military attache in Beijing describing China's need for such a system in the event of conflict with Taiwan.

Chinese military technicians have been struggling to acquire AWACS-type equipment since the United States pressured Israel in 2000 to back out of a $1 billion agreement to sell China four of its Phalcon phased-array radar systems. The systems also would have used Il-76 aircraft as a platform.

The main U.S. concern in blocking the sale was that China would gain a military advantage over Taiwan. Moreover, under the 1979 Taiwan Relations Act, the U.S. government has pledged to help Taiwan defend itself against any Chinese attack, meaning U.S. forces could become involved should fighting erupt.

For the same reasons, People's Liberation Army (PLA) air force leaders were determined to acquire such a plane. "After the 2000 Israeli fiasco, the PLA made it a matter of high pride to prove to the Americans they would not be denied AWACS," said Richard D. Fisher Jr., a U.S.-based specialist on the Chinese military.

At first, China turned to Russia, its traditional source of military equipment. The Beijing government concluded a deal to buy four Beriev A-50 Mainstay radar planes, which are roughly the Russian equivalent of the U.S. Air Force's E-3 Sentry AWACS. The purchase was believed to be the first phase of an agreement for up to eight of the Russian aircraft.

At the same time, however, Chinese scientists were at work on their own radar equipment. It is not known whether any of the Russian craft were ever delivered, which would have provided a look at the technology, or whether the technicians obtained help from Israeli or Russian counterparts. In any case, the Chinese AWACS that has begun test flights bears a strong resemblance to the A-50, which also uses the Il-76.

The AWACS could be operational within one or two years assuming the tests are successful, the specialists said. It was not known how many are planned for production, but Fisher noted eight would allow for a 24-hour patrol at both ends of the Taiwan Strait.

The Defense Ministry, which treats most military subjects as secret, did not reply to a request for information on the AWACS project.

Whatever the ultimate production schedule, AWACS development fits into a steady growth in the amount and sophistication of armaments on both sides of the strait, making a confrontation between China and Taiwan potentially one of the world's most dangerous.

The leadership has steadily increased military budgets in recent years and sought to reform the manpower-heavy but technology-short PLA as swiftly as possible. According to U.S. and Taiwanese officials, the government has deployed nearly 600 short-range ballistic missiles in southern China aimed at targets in Taiwan. The number grows by about 75 a year, they say.

Taiwan's president, Chen Shui-bian, who began a second four-year term in May, has insisted the 13,500-square mile territory is independent and should stay that way. Soon after taking office in May, his government decided on an $18.2 billion arms purchase from the United States, including 12 P-3C Orion submarine-hunting planes, eight diesel-electric submarines and six PAC-3 batteries equipped with more than 350 Patriot anti-missile missiles.

But the opposition Nationalist and People First parties, which have a majority in the legislature, declined this week to approve Chen's budget for the purchase, arguing it was too expensive and in some ways inappropriate for Taiwan's needs. The issue is unlikely to be resolved until after the next legislative elections, scheduled for Dec. 11.

In the meantime, both sides have continued individual purchases that notch up the technology level of their militaries by matching threat for threat.

China, for instance, in 2002 bought from Israel a number of Harpy anti-radar drones, which can loiter over enemy territory and drop munitions on radars turned on to guide air defenses. Meanwhile, Taiwan has obtained authorization from the Bush administration to buy high-speed anti-radiation missiles, which also can target air defenses by homing in on radar emissions, Chin Hui-chu, a Taiwanese legislator on the National Defense committee, recently told the Taiwan News.


http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard.../3682619.shtml
January 6th, 2005  
CABAL
 
 
In response of people who are critisizing the Type-98:

Your critism is typical. I've heard the same thing from military analysts who critisized the M-1A1 during the 1980's.

Another thing to point out, Type-98 is definetily not a direct duplication of a T-72. Although the Chassis and the hull has the origins of a T-72, the turret is boxlike unlike the T-72. Lets not go to further conclusions now since the tank has met PLA field requirements and is now ready to be in the Chinese Military inventory.

Surprisingly, the manufacturers at NORINCO are asking German Engine producers for further assistance. As far as I know, I just have this feeling that this tank is definetly not a copy.
January 6th, 2005  
gingerbeard
 
sorry technical error
--
Boots
January 6th, 2005  
gingerbeard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabal
Quote:
Frankly, if Chaing Kaishek had won the civil war in the late 40's, China would very likely have surpassed the USA and Europe already. China would be the most important and powerfuld nation on Earth right now. You can hate the KMT all you want, but they wouldn't have made such an awful mess of things with Communist ideologies, the Cultural Revolution and the Great Leap Forward.
godofthunder9010, you'll need to show certain respect to political ideologies. I see you are from the United States, a country known for its hysterical Anti-Communist rhetoric in the past. So please, reconsider.

Generalisimo Chiang Kai Shek was a corrupt leader who recieved persistant amounts of generous monetary donations from the United States for the war efforts, but most of them were kept in his personal ample bank accounts. During the late 1930's ever since Chiang Kai Shek had the priviledge to lead the entire nation, KMT have turned itself from a one party Republic into a corrupt military-runned absolustist government. So in this case, Mr. Chiang is no different than Mao Zhedong in terms of progress. However, both of them share the same dream, unity and stability. Regardless of their mistakes, I respect both of them.
u r right, in fact the US people dun seem to understand about china, perfect example: india and china. india is a democracy and britian have left indian in a better state. plus no big dieaster like the cultural revolution and the Great leap. Look at china today, its development its 3 times better than india. just look at the figures at india or any sources u find on the internet.

u see, when a country is in a bad state, u need a strong ruling party, when a country is in bad state, democracy wont work since there is so many civil strife between its people the people cannot put the democracy into gd use, like india.

look at japan, if u look at japan in 1800, its was its "dictatoral" emperor which made japan so advance and powerful in the 20 century.

look at india, sorry i am not trying ot bash it, but they were in a much better state than china before in 1950-60s, and still the chinese beat them in war, but now, if u go to their country, its a mess! i've been to india, i went to new delhi and delhi, suppose to be the best city in india, but still u see naked kids walking around, taking their dumps in the streets like its a toilet. and people put up a tent in the streets to create a house, the streets are full of that smell from the toilet. i pitied them! china today overtakes india in every field, even its armies.

if u go to china, u will see a much better place than that. in fact it's changing so fast u will see a difference if u go every year.

lemme tell u something, why the chinese people didnt rebel against its government today, its because it's doing well, like Hitler did in the 1930s, pretty much every german liked him at that time. in 1989 is different cos the chinese gov. wasnt achieving as much as the people wanted, now its different.
January 6th, 2005  
CABAL
 
 
Quote:
in 1989 is different cos the chinese gov. wasnt achieving as much as the people wanted, now its different.
Actually during the late 1980's, China was achieving much. The demonstration came from the influences from two major ideological beliefs, The Great Proleterian Cultural Revolution and the political system of Democracy. You brew these factors together and you get the T-Square Massacre as a product.

The definition of "The People" can vary depending on beliefs from the east and the west.
January 6th, 2005  
gingerbeard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabal
Quote:
in 1989 is different cos the chinese gov. wasnt achieving as much as the people wanted, now its different.
Actually during the late 1980's, China was achieving much. The demonstration came from the influences from two major ideological beliefs, The Great Proleterian Cultural Revolution and the political system of Democracy. You brew these factors together and you get the T-Square Massacre as a product.

The definition of "The People" can vary depending on beliefs from the east and the west.
yes u r right, but still, it wasnt achieving as much as it is now.
January 6th, 2005  
CABAL
 
 
It is strange. For people who were once anti-China suddenly reversed their views after they visit the country itself. Although it can lead to jealousy, we usually put that aside and look towards cooperation. It explains the paramount existance of Ambassadors and Embassies stationed around the world.
January 6th, 2005  
gingerbeard
 
yes it because they dun believe the chinese government works, most people are against the government rather than its people. but again since people in the US dun get taught about the chinese system properly, i ask my father to tell about about it, since i dun really see much books written by westerner about today's chinese gov. they do but its always critizing. in fact us hystrical anti-communist hasnt changed much at all. and alot of them dun even know that the gov. in china isnt really communist anymore. they still call them "commies" which makes me wanna laugh how ignorant those people are.
January 6th, 2005  
Kane
 
Quote:
yes it because they dun believe the chinese government works, most people are against the government rather than its people. but again since people in the US dun get taught about the chinese system properly, i ask my father to tell about about it, since i dun really see much books written by westerner about today's chinese gov. they do but its always critizing. in fact us hystrical anti-communist hasnt changed much at all. and alot of them dun even know that the gov. in china isnt really communist anymore. they still call them "commies" which makes me wanna laugh how ignorant those people are.
Don't generalize. I'm not among of those Americans you talked about. I respect communism, I respect capitalism. Both of these economic systems aim towards better living of the people.
January 6th, 2005  
gingerbeard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane
Quote:
yes it because they dun believe the chinese government works, most people are against the government rather than its people. but again since people in the US dun get taught about the chinese system properly, i ask my father to tell about about it, since i dun really see much books written by westerner about today's chinese gov. they do but its always critizing. in fact us hystrical anti-communist hasnt changed much at all. and alot of them dun even know that the gov. in china isnt really communist anymore. they still call them "commies" which makes me wanna laugh how ignorant those people are.
Don't generalize. I'm not among of those Americans you talked about. I respect communism, I respect capitalism. Both of these economic systems aim towards better living of the people.
sorry u got me wrong, i mean i laugh at the people who still call them commies. i dun mean to laugh at americans. dun get me wrong here. sorry to write it so unclearly