Bolt Action vs. Semi Auto - Page 3




 
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August 16th, 2005  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RnderSafe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadet Seaman
And yes Hollywood played a big roll in calling bolt actions "sniper rilfes" but you pretty much snipe with anything. Put a scope on an M60 and put the fire selector on semi and your good. As long as you can get a long range, controled shot.
It sounds more like Hollywood gave you this idea. In reality, this is not so.
Well, no. Sgt. Carlos Hathcock USMC Ret. gave my the idea.
August 16th, 2005  
LeEnfield
 
 
Missileer.......Were we talking about the difference between a bolt action rifle and semi/automatic one. Quite often as a sniper you may have a number of targets to take out quickly which would need a few rapid shots, one for each target and in this situation a self loading rifle really comes into it's own, as you have several shots en route before the first one has arrived.
August 16th, 2005  
RnderSafe
 
 
Quote:
And a heavy weapon like the M2 Browning, M1919, and the M60 make great sniper platforms.
No, they really don't.
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August 16th, 2005  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RnderSafe
Quote:
And a heavy weapon like the M2 Browning, M1919, and the M60 make great sniper platforms.
No, they really don't.
Depends. The M2 did quite well. But its really a difference of opinion.
August 16th, 2005  
Missileer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeEnfield
Missileer.......Were we talking about the difference between a bolt action rifle and semi/automatic one. Quite often as a sniper you may have a number of targets to take out quickly which would need a few rapid shots, one for each target and in this situation a self loading rifle really comes into it's own, as you have several shots en route before the first one has arrived.
That may be but the only rifles we put night vision scopes on for snipers were bolt action. Most snipers can operate a bolt almost as fast as a semi-auto.

If you will open this site and make a count of bolt action vs semi, you will find more bolt actions.

http://www.snipercentral.com/rifles.htm Sniper rifles of the world
August 16th, 2005  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeEnfield
Missileer.......Were we talking about the difference between a bolt action rifle and semi/automatic one. Quite often as a sniper you may have a number of targets to take out quickly which would need a few rapid shots, one for each target and in this situation a self loading rifle really comes into it's own, as you have several shots en route before the first one has arrived.
That may be but the only rifles we put night vision scopes on for snipers were bolt action. Most snipers can operate a bolt almost as fast as a semi-auto.

If you will open this site and make a count of bolt action vs semi, you will find more bolt actions.

http://www.snipercentral.com/rifles.htm Sniper rifles of the world
Not true Missileer. We put scopes on the M16A1 for a snipers spotter in Veitnam and still do, do the same for the M21.
August 17th, 2005  
RnderSafe
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadet Seaman
Not true Missileer. We put scopes on the M16A1 for a snipers spotter in Veitnam and still do, do the same for the M21.
I can put a scope on a water pistol, it won't make it a SWS.

The M16 is not, nor has it ever been a sniper rifle, just as the M60 isn't.

Quote:
Depends. The M2 did quite well. But its really a difference of opinion.
A difference in practical and real world experience.
August 17th, 2005  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RnderSafe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadet Seaman
Not true Missileer. We put scopes on the M16A1 for a snipers spotter in Veitnam and still do, do the same for the M21.
I can put a scope on a water pistol, it won't make it a SWS.

The M16 is not, nor has it ever been a sniper rifle, just as the M60 isn't.

Quote:
Depends. The M2 did quite well. But its really a difference of opinion.
A difference in practical and real world experience.
Have you read Dear Mom: A sniper Vietnam? In the book they use the M16 as a SWS. It is a true story, writen by J.T.Ward.

You could put a scope on a water pistol and call it a SWS.

What really dfineds what a SWS is? Its a weapon that can be sniped with. Lenardo Davinci almost invented a sniping rifle to "snipe at the enemy from the walls of Veince". Snipers where used in the Civil War, they used Springfield rifles with long copper tubes called "scopes: to snipe an enemy, they wore green coats to match the landscape.

So what is a SWS? You can snipe with any weapon, the KAR 89k was used as a sniper rifle. It was just a rifle with a scope. Same with the M16.

Sgt. Carlos Hathcock used a M2 Browning as a SWS, and had gotten the world furthest shot until recently.
August 17th, 2005  
LeEnfield
 
 
Missiler........I went to war with a bolt action rifle and I know just what they can, are can't do. Also all the British weapons can be fitted with night scope. Also all the SA.80 range are issued with an optical scope, also I fought with an AK 47 which also had a spring loaded bayonet which was great fun, but the metal they made the bayonet out of was pure rubbish.
August 17th, 2005  
Missileer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeEnfield
Missiler........I went to war with a bolt action rifle and I know just what they can, are can't do. Also all the British weapons can be fitted with night scope. Also all the SA.80 range are issued with an optical scope, also I fought with an AK 47 which also had a spring loaded bayonet which was great fun, but the metal they made the bayonet out of was pure rubbish.
Yeah, a lot of Countries just hated to get rid of their bolt actions. Germany and Japan kept them through the war. I guess the brass thought semi-autos wasted ammo but the M1 was a great infantry weapon. There were accurized M1s but I think they were just used in target matches. About night scopes, I was referring to VARO and LITTON night vision companies. We had rifles loaned to us for testing, I don't know what they put them on when they left us. You can see the little short scopes on the M16s in clips of Iraq, they are what make the infantryman "own the night". But not every soldier with a night scope is a sniper, it just gives him an edge.

Just an aside, I worked on contract for a small company that was building a 20mm machine gun. It could be fitted with a laser dot scope in the ground mode. All I did was design the electronic control box for motors and solenoids to operate the bolt and sear mechanisms also the belt feed motor and high voltage to fire the round since they don't use firing pins anymore. It fired about 4 to 5 rounds per second.