Australian Tiger

Probably not in performance, but in off-sets and price. You don't have to have the most advanced chopper to have the upper hand. Having a higher number of a lesser heli at a cheaper price usually tends to get the job done better.

Like cutting F-22 orders in favor of the F-35... :whip:
 
Would you happen to know a price? I'm having a difficult time trying to get prices on helicopters.

Thanks
 
the Tiger has a superior surveillance capacity than the apache- the spec called for an armed recon helicopter not for an attack helicopter.
there is an additional cost in the tiger component because, unlike normal people, the Australian Army insists on keeping its rotor assets on an airfield surrounded on three sides by sea water.

i can give you the package price but the European assembled tigers are a different price to the Australian assembled ones. did you still want the info?
 
Hi bren122
Thanks I'll take what ever you have.
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The Tiger looks like powerful bird that could bring down a lot of hurt on bad guys. I would like to learn more about it really any other info, good web sites, etc, please pass it on.
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They'll probably never see action, just like the 60 Abrams we just bought. So expensive we can't afford to lose them.
 
the Tiger is probably the best helicopter recon platform going at the moment- but it looks so much like a war machine that deploying it in any but a combat scenario would be seen as an escalation! so now the Army wants to buy some Kiowa replacements to provide a less intimidating recon force. so the scenario that everyone pointed out at the start- a separate recon/ attack force structure- is going to come about anyway at twice the cost.

the contracted price was $Aus1.3billion dollars to provide 4 European assembled and 18 Australian assembled Tigers plus a Full Flight Mission Simulator and other training materials.

this site details the history of the acquisition project
http://www.defence.gov.au/dmo/asd/air87/main.cfm#history

this one details the tiger's performance
http://www.defence.gov.au/dmo/asd/air87/eurocopter.cfm

Contact; Air, Land & Sea is a news mag on Aus and NZ defence with a lot of articles about helicopters
http://www.contactairlandandsea.com/

Australian & New Zealand defender is another news mag on defence but more of a look at the land and sea than the air arms- some good Helicopter pics though.
http://www.australiandefender.com.au/

Defence Today is the Aus Defence Ministry's mag- heaps of stuff and the most informed but tends to be a little too pro-government policy for my tastes
http://www.defencenews.com.au/defence-today.cfm

Haven't read this for a while (went more civilian than military but i am told it is going back to the old format) but it used to have some of the most detailed coverage of military aviation in Australia. even better than the RAAF magazine for a long time.
http://www.ausaviation.com.au/
 
Wallabies said:
They'll probably never see action, just like the 60 Abrams we just bought. So expensive we can't afford to lose them.
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unless we get invaded where they are we have no way of getting the bloody things anywhere. the semis we bought to move them can't get off the highways- the rail carriages we bought aren't rated for the line- none of our current landing ships can carry them which is just as well because none of our landing craft can carry them ashore. even the C-17's we just bought can't take them unless the weather is right.
if we deploy them in South East Asia they would soon be stranded because only @20% of the bridges can take the weight.
even at home they are a problem- the old bake a cake problem is back! the air conditioner isn't powerful enough! In Australia our armoured units have big sun shades on exercises and deployments because the vehicles can get so hot that you can bake a cake! the air conditioners run in the early morning and late evening but in the middle of the day you have a one in three chance of the thing not working.
did you hear our reconditioned M113's now have a problem with their tracks- apparently they have been so loaded down with new kits that the tracks start to disintegrate at speeds over 30 kph.
 
did you hear our reconditioned M113's now have a problem with their tracks- apparently they have been so loaded down with new kits that the tracks start to disintegrate at speeds over 30 kph.
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I heard they were getting rid of them. I think only 5 and 7 are using them now in the ARA and that is only for exercises. No RAAC units use them now.

- the old bake a cake problem is back! the air conditioner isn't powerful enough! In Australia our armoured units have big sun shades on exercises and deployments because the vehicles can get so hot that you can bake a cake! the air conditioners run in the early morning and late evening but in the middle of the day you have a one in three chance of the thing not working.
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I'm sure it's hotter in Iraq.

I trialled the chopper they want to replace the Blackhawk with and it's a piece of ****, too bad they've already spent 6 billion on it. Go Generals, keeping their jobs by ****ing up ours.
 
About once a month the Australian Newspaper runs a page or two dedicated to defence issues. the one from January featured the air conditioning problem and made note that one of the criteria was crew comfort- they reported that the Abrams was a little cramped compared to some but that the air conditioner was fitted as standard whereas the Europeans were going to charge extra for a fitting on some of theirs. so if the comfort criteria was an important consideration then the fact that the air conditioner does not work properly is an issue. the report suggested that the Abrams had had similar problems with its a/c units in Iraq.
the M113 features all the time- the Australian's defence editors seem to like the Warrior and push it as a replacement for the M113 on a regular basis. last year the Labor government looked like it was going to replace the M113 in 5 and 7 RAR with something like the Warrior or Bradley and there was a spate of stories regarding the problems experienced in the latest upgrade of the M113 that included the transmission, drive train and track technology being 40 years old and not rated for the extra 100s of kilograms being added with each upgrade.

i have been in areas that get up to high 40's and low 50's- many a mine site is in just such a location. i am pretty sure that the live ranges in the Northern Territory and South Australia have had low 50's record temperatures in the last couple of years. woomera, which is just down the road from the SA facility has had a high 50 degree day this summer- a scramjet experiment was cancelled because of it. these are about as hot as i have heard from Iraq.

i haven't seen much about either of the Euro-copters save that their powerplants are not as powerful as advertised. so far they seem to be performing to spec otherwise. i thought that the sikorsky chopper was the superior choice in the medium role- it was established in service and was superior to the blackhawk in almost every category. but you have to admit that the MRH-90 looks good on paper. given defence's record with new platforms it seemed a little risky to go that way again.
 
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