Anti-Aircraft guns - Page 3




 
--
 
January 24th, 2005  
k19
 
Mr. Rumsfeld said " you go to war with the army you have, not the army you might want or wish to have at a later time."


i think it will apply here well.
January 24th, 2005  
Whispering Death
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chinaman
ive heard of iraqi soldiers firing their rifles into the air before apaches owned them with the chian gun, aparently they wasted precious ammo
Not to mention giving away their positions.
January 24th, 2005  
A Can of Man
 
 
Really? Well then explain the A-10. That thing can take enormous amounts of damage and still be air worthy. It was proven during the first gulf war. They came with all sorts of damage but they did make it back.
The Apache was designed with this in mind. It's predicessor, the AH-1 Cobra wasn't really.
Speed and surprise and quick retreat behind the line of sight is the helicopter's chief self defense, but the Apache can take a few knocks.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/ah-64.htm
"The Apache has a full range of aircraft survivability equipment and has the ability to withstand hits from rounds up to 23MM in critical areas."

http://www.aviationnow.com/avnow/new...pache05013.xml
"Having 30 aircraft sustain the fire that they did, and bring 29 crews back - that's the definition of survivability," a retired senior Army officer who commanded an Apache unit during Desert Storm told Aerospace Daily."

http://www.aerospaceweb.org/aircraft/helicopter-m/ah64/
To meet these challenges, Hughes Helicopter (later purchased by McDonnell Douglas) designed a rugged tandem two-seat aircraft with powerful engines, advanced avionics, and armor protection over key portions of the vehicle able to absorb up to 23-mm fire. In addition to an armor-plated cockpit able to withstand 12.7-mm strikes, the AH-64 Apache was fitted with energy absorbing landing gear and a collapsible chain gun to maximize crew survivability in a crash.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EuroSpike
It comes down, don't worry. The worst enemy of the helo pilot is one single man armed with assault rifle. Hits by 23mm and 12.7mm will at least damage badly and every spot isn't armored at all.

To get helo armored enough to take hits, would it's weight increase too heavy to get fly. Usually helo's rely more in tactics, cover and speed than armor's thickness.
--
January 25th, 2005  
Chinaman
 
what bout armor near the engine, is that very effective or not??

plus, shooting the hell out of the rear blade is pretty deadly as well,. 23mms could tanke out the rear blades andthe heli would be useless
January 25th, 2005  
EuroSpike
 
"Really? Well then explain the A-10. That thing can take enormous amounts of damage and still be air worthy."

I guess A-10's hull is designed to be able to take holes and keep it still in one piece and airborne. I guess that is quite important feature demand when desinging an attack plane since they draw a lot of small calibre AA fire on them.

The worst problem to limite aircraft's and helo's armor is the weight wich increases easily too heavy. Some modern light armoring materials like composite etc. can be used but making flying objects 100% immune to AA fire is not possible with materials presented. The most critical areas like cocpit are armored but not all and helo's take more cover on their speed and tactics, for example helo climbs behind trees, shoots few shots and then returns back floating behind trees before enemy AA takes helo in sights.
January 25th, 2005  
AlexKall
 
Wasn't the A-10 just armored in the body, around the cocpit?
January 25th, 2005  
A Can of Man
 
 
Well this is the Apache thread so let's make a separate A-10 thread then.