Air Assault




 
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May 6th, 2010  
sunnyside
 

Topic: Air Assault


During a discussion on another forum about the new Growler, I came to realize that I didn't know much about air assaults, and the other guys, even the veterans we have, knew even less.

So I was hoping some people here could fill the civvies and old ground pounders in on this aspect of modern warfare, particularily in the context of the V-22 and the sort of missions you might want a Growler for. Obviously the V-22 hasn't seen a lot of actual use, but I'm hoping that the training being done with the V-22, and possibly what is done with helicopters, would show at least what the Marines are preparing to be able to do.

That might be too broad a question, though long answers would be sweet, but I'll give some more specific ones you could reply to if you only have a moment.

1. Would the Marines conduct operations with V-22s far enough out that they would no longer have air support from choppers? What about going out without any air support at all due to logistics or range?

2. What are the typical missions of air assaults? What are some important expected missions that might need to be undertaken? I figure those two are different because we're currently only fighting insurgencies which is rather different from a new invasion.

3. When conducting an air assault is the general plan that the transports land some distance from where the enemy is expected to be, and the forces inside advance on foot?
May 6th, 2010  
KJ
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnyside
During a discussion on another forum about the new Growler, I came to realize that I didn't know much about air assaults, and the other guys, even the veterans we have, knew even less.

So I was hoping some people here could fill the civvies and old ground pounders in on this aspect of modern warfare, particularily in the context of the V-22 and the sort of missions you might want a Growler for. Obviously the V-22 hasn't seen a lot of actual use, but I'm hoping that the training being done with the V-22, and possibly what is done with helicopters, would show at least what the Marines are preparing to be able to do.

That might be too broad a question, though long answers would be sweet, but I'll give some more specific ones you could reply to if you only have a moment.

1. Would the Marines conduct operations with V-22s far enough out that they would no longer have air support from choppers? What about going out without any air support at all due to logistics or range?

2. What are the typical missions of air assaults? What are some important expected missions that might need to be undertaken? I figure those two are different because we're currently only fighting insurgencies which is rather different from a new invasion.

3. When conducting an air assault is the general plan that the transports land some distance from where the enemy is expected to be, and the forces inside advance on foot?

1. you will not go in in a V-22 without air support.
Not against a working or even semi working air defence.
Out of chopper range, unlikely with the option of inflight refueling.

2. I think air assaulters are largely made with fighting an insurgency in mind.
They were first stood up against another insurgency (RVN)
Troops today work alot from an airborne platform since the skies are friendly and the IED threat on the ground is very real.
What they are capable of doing is readily available to read about on the internet but I am not even going to go into hypothetic missiontemplates on an open board.

3. Depends on terrain and mission.
Optimal would be to land in already secured terrain and/or with massive firesupport over the LZ and then take terrain from there.

//KJ.
May 9th, 2010  
sunnyside
 
So would you say that the point of the V-22 isn't it's range (aside from its logistical convenience) because it won't operate where shorter ranged helicopters aren't?
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May 9th, 2010  
A Can of Man
 
 
Fighter jets.
May 9th, 2010  
AVON
 

Topic: Re: Air Assault


Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnyside
So would you say that the point of the V-22 isn't it's range (aside from its logistical convenience) because it won't operate where shorter ranged helicopters aren't?
There are several advantages of the V-22 over helos. The V-22 can operate at higher altitudes than a helo. A handy capability in places such as Afghanistan. The load the V-22 can carry, can be done for a longer range as well as a higher speed.
Being able to travel at a higher speed and altitude translates into a better chance to mid-air refuel in bad weather!
May 9th, 2010  
Hook160th
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVON
There are several advantages of the V-22 over helos. The V-22 can operate at higher altitudes than a helo. A handy capability in places such as Afghanistan. The load the V-22 can carry, can be done for a longer range as well as a higher speed.
Being able to travel at a higher speed and altitude translates into a better chance to mid-air refuel in bad weather!
There are also disadvantages. What helicopter are you comparing it with?
May 26th, 2010  
AVON
 

Topic: Re: Air Assault


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hook160th
There are also disadvantages. What helicopter are you comparing it with?
There only a few of helos that can carry a heavier load (CH-47, CH-53, etc.), some have a greater rate of climb (the Apache, Super Cobra, Kamov Ka-50, CH-47, CH-53, etc.), no combat helo is faster, none can they obtain the altitude while carrying a load and, none have the operational radius of a V-22.
The Osprey has unique capabilities, it fills nitch! It will not replace many helos but, will provide the US Military with capabilities it currently does not.
May 27th, 2010  
Hook160th
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVON
There only a few of helos that can carry a heavier load (CH-47, CH-53, etc.), some have a greater rate of climb (the Apache, Super Cobra, Kamov Ka-50, CH-47, CH-53, etc.), no combat helo is faster, none can they obtain the altitude while carrying a load and, none have the operational radius of a V-22.
The Osprey has unique capabilities, it fills nitch! It will not replace many helos but, will provide the US Military with capabilities it currently does not.

As far as operational radius, there are at least 3 types of helicopters that have mid-air refueling capabilities, and can also carry extra fuel internally. One problem I see with the V-22, is it`s ability to defend itself. In the "helicopter" mode, the engines are in the way on both sides, limiting fields of fire. There are many problems with the aircraft right now. Tons of articles have been written attesting to this. Don`t misunderstand me, the aircraft is new and will naturally have many bugs to work out. It will have it`s role to play, and I hope it turns out to be a great aircraft.
 


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