The Afghan Taliban detainees - Lawful or Unlawful Combatants - Page 3




View Poll Results :Are the Taliban Lawful or Unlawful Combatants?
Unlawful 6 37.50%
Lawful 10 62.50%
Neither Combatants or NonCombatants 0 0%
Voters: 16. You may not vote on this poll

 
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Boots
 
June 22nd, 2005  
PershingOfLSU
 
They are tried according to Taliban laws.

Those serving in a Taliban regular army unit or militia and captured while openly bearing arms or in uniform can only be tried for war crimes. However, most of the detainees don't fall into this category. Someone who shoots at United States soldiers while neither openly bearing arms or wearing a uniform can be tried for attempted murder of murder should they have succeeded. If they were attempting to gather informaiton about allied operations then they can be tried for espionage and according to the Geneva Convention, executed. If they were captured for taking part in a terrorist operation outside of the country of capture then it gets more complicated. However the Geneva convention does provide for the execution of civilians involved in serious acts of sabotage. As long as the pre-invasion penal code allowed for it.
June 22nd, 2005  
bulldogg
 
 
Ok, which Taliban laws did they break when they defended their country against invasion by US forces?
June 22nd, 2005  
Redneck
 
 
Pershing (and any other member posting facts or what they believe are facts), provide your sources.

Staurofilakes, any further instigation of flame wars will result in me personally banning you. Tone down your language and patronization of other members immediately.
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Boots
June 22nd, 2005  
CSmaster
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PershingOfLSU
They are tried according to Taliban laws.

Those serving in a Taliban regular army unit or militia and captured while openly bearing arms or in uniform can only be tried for war crimes. However, most of the detainees don't fall into this category. Someone who shoots at United States soldiers while neither openly bearing arms or wearing a uniform can be tried for attempted murder of murder should they have succeeded. If they were attempting to gather informaiton about allied operations then they can be tried for espionage and according to the Geneva Convention, executed. If they were captured for taking part in a terrorist operation outside of the country of capture then it gets more complicated. However the Geneva convention does provide for the execution of civilians involved in serious acts of sabotage. As long as the pre-invasion penal code allowed for it.
k....they are murders

now give them trials plz, and u call them murders without letting them have lawyers to defend themselves

how hypocritic you are,
you are doing this while telling other nations to have fair trials

and by the way, i never heard anybody using other nations' laws to sentence somebody who is in jail in U.S (Gitmo is part of U.S i consider)
June 22nd, 2005  
Redneck
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSmaster
how hypocratic u r,
Didn't know we had a doctor in the house.


CSmaster, while on this forum, please try to use full words, this isn't an instant messenger and in the interest of maintaining clear communication, refrain from treating it as such.


Bulldog, provide your own sources as well, simply stating that someone is wrong because you say so doesn't cut it. If you disagree with someone's facts, lay out your own verifiable information to counter them.
June 22nd, 2005  
CSmaster
 
sorry, i am just used to type like that on msn

REMOVED. Any issues with the moderating here should be taken up with the Administrator.
June 22nd, 2005  
PershingOfLSU
 
As I'm essentially repeating the same thing over and over again. My source still hasn't changed since I first posted it in this thread:

http://www.genevaconventions.org/
June 22nd, 2005  
Corocotta
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PershingOfLSU
As I'm essentially repeating the same thing over and over again. My source still hasn't changed since I first posted it in this thread:

http://www.genevaconventions.org/
Well, it seems that we will never agree. For me is crystal clear that they are lawful combats, talibans were the soldiers of the afgan goverment.
The last point of article 4 is also very expresive: Inhabitants of a non-occupied territory, who on the approach of the enemy spontaneously take up arms to resist the invading forces, without having had time to form themselves into regular armed units, provided they carry arms openly and respect the laws and customs of war.

So in the concept of prisioner of law we will have at least these two groups. Are you saying that non of the arrested in Guantanamo fits inn them?

And, in the hypothetical case that they were unlawful combats, they can not be tortured under any circunstance.
Universal Declaration Of Human Rights;
Article 5: No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

Also read article 1 here: http://www.hrweb.org/legal/cat.html

I would love if you can explain me point by point why any of the detenied in Guantanamo donīt fit in any of the six points of article 4 GC against torture: http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/91.htm
June 22nd, 2005  
PershingOfLSU
 
I already stated previously that the regular Taliban military are lawful combatants.

However, what I was referring to was members of the insurgency who do not follow the Geneva convention nor do they openly bear arms or wear clearly seperate themselves from the civilian population. Which is almost the entire Iraqi insurgency. Parts of the Afghani insurgency however are lawful combatants as they only attack United States and Afghani troops and openly bear arms in the remote regions of Afghanistan they inhabit.

Those captured for connections to terrorist activities elsewhere would not be lawful combatants as they have attacked United States interests through sabotage. For example the World Trade Center bombings, the embassy bombings, and other such terrorist actions aimed at civilians.

I would love if you can point out where I said it was legal for us to torture those at Guantanamo.
June 23rd, 2005  
CSmaster
 
k, they are murders.

did u give them a trial, an american style trial as they are confined in U.S prison..


did u>?