MightyMacbeth wrote:

"I think the atomic bomb was necessary to halt the Japanese and to make them think otherwise. In fact, the Japanese were already demoralized and are close to nothing. Land forces having dramatic shortages and are getting sicker. Fly boys are mere recruits compared to the pilots who joined before and at the beginning of the war. Saburo Sakai is an interesting figure. Imagine if all the pilots were like him. Anyways, there were many factors that disheartened the Japanese, and the Japan at the beginning of the war, was not like the Japan at the last years of it. With the atomic bomb.......the Japanese empire was no more. As a matter of fact, some of the Japanese generals wanted to continue the war, but the emperor (Emperor "Showa" Hirohito) refused, and decided to surrender. Some of the other generals committed suicide.
Also, one guy named Kenji Hatanaka planned to stop the emperors surrender speech and to make the Japanese to fight on...his mission was mostly successful , but failed"..

That's the first time I've heard of Kenji Hatanaka, or such an in depth account of the morale and military state of japan at the end of the war. Thats why I love these forums. Thanks MightyMacbeth

lol, u are welcome and anytime

Without the Atom Bomb, the US would have found itself entering the bloodiest single theater of battle in its entire history. 1 Million is VERY conservative. The USA and its soldiers were tough and all, but it would have been a very painful process. No doubt, guerilla warfare would have been widespread and initiated by small children. Much like Vietnam no doubt. Also, Soviet intervention/assistance would have become more and more of a foregone conclusion. The Cold War Ero would have seen Japan divided between a Communist controlled nation and a democratic/capitalist nation. Who knows how many other messes that would have led to?

The world can rail against the inhumanity and cruelty of the US dropping the A-bombs, but critics seldom bother to contemplate what would have happened without them. Because Japan surrendered, countless women and children were never enlisted to be human bombs, countless other citizens were saved from inadvertant death from the fighting, and the Japanese Military kept its remaining sons alive.

The US and Allies would have won out in the long run, nobody should doubt that. It just would have been very ugly.

tahts what we were talking bout

Originally Posted by godofthunder9010

Also, Soviet intervention/assistance would have become more and more of a foregone conclusion. The Cold War Ero would have seen Japan divided between a Communist controlled nation and a democratic/capitalist nation. Who knows how many other messes that would have led to?

Wow, I never though about it like that. Interesting

Ｉ don,t think as you think.
Those days,Trade of japan was cut by mine and submarine.
and,factorys were also destoroyed by B-29.
but,witohout atomich bomb,Surrender of Japan became late a month.
Ｓｏｖｉｅｔ might invade Japan mainland and occupy all korea&North of HOKKAIDO.
US might fight against NJ as Korea war.

thats a new view

Originally Posted by sandy

Ｉ don,t think as you think.
Those days,Trade of japan was cut by mine and submarine.
and,factorys were also destoroyed by B-29.
but,witohout atomich bomb,Surrender of Japan became late a month.
Ｓｏｖｉｅｔ might invade Japan mainland and occupy all korea&North of HOKKAIDO.
US might fight against NJ as Korea war.

I disagree with the assumption that Japan "was on the verge of surrendering anyways" etc, for one simple reason. The attempt was made to kidnap the Emperor and prevent him from surrending AFTER Nagasaki had the A-bomb dropped on it. The military leaders of Japan did not truly represent the wishes of its citizens and the were way way out of touch in all honesty. Nonetheless, the WERE in control and they were determined to keep fighting till no Japanese citizen was alive to fight. Quite simply, they were NUTS!! Their do or die mentality cost far too much Japanese blood anyways. The reality of the Atom Bomb denied them of their idealizedl "fighting to the very last." They were faced with the prospect of sitting idly by while every city in their nation was erased from existance one by one, and no real chance of stopping it and no real means of retaliation.

If Japan had been a democratic nation at that point, they war with the United States may not have ever happened. If it had occurred, the Japanese people would have demanded an end to it far sooner that what actually happened in WW2. It is not the Japanese people that were the problem It was the miltary hawks.

The invasion of Japan would have worked but it would have been very costly.I'd estimate caualities as being 2-3 million had we invaded Japan.

The japanese NEVER would have surrenedered until the Allies took Tokyo. We would have had to fight them clean into the waters, like on Okinawa. Even with the Soviets helping, I think it may have taken until as late as 1947 to complete. Millions on both sides would have died.

I agree sandy, the Japanese Civil War might have instead been the conflict. However, MacArthur couldn't have driven the North Japanese into China, so I think present-day may have remained the same.