Originally Posted by Kinection

You make it sound like the people wanted their land to be taken. And yes, this was the past. To my knowledge, America has not "taken" any land personally since then, installing governments on the other hand...

You're putting words in my mouth. Look carefully -- "That was bad of America." But it can't be undone, and that was more than 100 years ago. 100 years ago, China was busy massacring anyone who tried to modernize and being pretty damn stupid in general. Over 100 years ago, China was purposely pissing off the European powers just as much as they could, not comprehending that they would get their asses handed to them in response. 100+ years ago, China was clueless. The world of 100+ years ago was ed up in general. Why are we talking about events 100+ years old?

Fast forward to today. There are some small, insignificant independence movements out there. Otherwise, given the chance to go back to being their own nation, Hawaii or any other state in the USA would overwhelmingly vote against it.

Of course it matters, if the people of Taiwan don't want to unite, then there will be problems. If the people do want to unite, then it would go much easier. Simple as that, and that was what I was talking about when I was talking about the Taiwanese.

My point is that if Taiwan were to decide in favor of independence, China attacks and probably will end up killing a very substantial portion of the population of Taiwan. The point is that, from China's point of view, they do not have the right to voice any opinion but one -- "We are part of China." All other opinions are treason. So no, they are not allowed to come up with their own opinion on the matter according to PRC.

As to my statement that "China is willing to kill every living thing on that island rather than let them declare independence", it is my understanding that 99.9% of the people of the PRC are in favor of invasion if independence is declared. Predictions are that Taiwan will be subdued almost instantly, but what if it doesn't work out that way? China, according to some of it's people that have posted here, are more than happy to start dropping nukes if there is any trouble taking the island by force. More trouble? More nukes. United States gets involved? Nuke it!!

You're putting words in my mouth. Look carefully -- "That was bad of America." But it can't be undone, and that was more than 100 years ago. 100 years ago, China was busy massacring anyone who tried to modernize and being pretty damn stupid in general. Over 100 years ago, China was purposely pissing off the European powers just as much as they could, not comprehending that they would get their asses handed to them in response. 100+ years ago, China was clueless. The world of 100+ years ago was Censored ed up in general. Why are we talking about events 100+ years old?

Nonono. You see, I'm saying that you made it sound like it, not that you said it. When I read it, it made me think that the people welcomed the Americans. My brain must of not put enough emphasis on "That was bad of America." I also agree that it can't be undone, as I said in my post that it was in the past.


The argument on Taiwan not being able to have an opinion sounds kind of weak to me. It looks more like opinion and speculation, along with the kill everybody on Taiwan argument. Invasion does not mean extermination of everything.

Can you link me to the nuke Taiwan things? I'd like to read up more on this, since I have a hard time believeing that China would nuke Taiwan.

The US does not officially recognize Taiwan as an independent country.

The parts about killing, invading and nuking were posted on this very site. I'll try to find them (if they haven't been removed due to time that is).

I note that you are not disagreeing with the "If Taiwan declares independence, China invades." part. What would be useful to know: Do you agree that the Chinese miltary should invade Taiwan if they declare their independence?

Whether the USA recognizes them as a separate country isn't a realistic measure of anything here. The USA used to recognize the Taipei government as the "true government of China". The recognition of the People's Republic of China as the "official" government was a move by the USA for better relations with the PRC. The USA's foreign policy on the matter has been akin to childrens' fairy tales compared to reality.

I don't think China should risk the consequences of a Taiwan invasion, at least in their current military state.

I for one, actually do believe that Taiwan should be united with China but I do not find invasion to be the only avenues of approach. As China's economic power grows, I think the prospect of joining China would be more enticing and if Taiwan does declare independence, then I believe economic repercussions should be a better approach than outright invasion.

The Links to the topics containing mention of nuking and/or invading Taiwan into compliance:

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum...ghlight=taiwan

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum...ghlight=taiwan

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum...ghlight=taiwan

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum...aiwan&start=60

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum...ghlight=taiwan

You will probably note that all or most are locked due to flamewars.

I don't think China should risk the consequences of a Taiwan invasion, at least in their current military state.

I for one, actually do believe that Taiwan should be united with China but I do not find invasion to be the only avenues of approach. As China's economic power grows, I think the prospect of joining China would be more enticing and if Taiwan does declare independence, then I believe economic repercussions should be a better approach than outright invasion

That's a refreshing point of view.

I'm not entirely sure how well that economic sactions or the like are going to affect Taiwan though, but time will tell.

For China's sake I hope so.

Because no good can come of this.

China's military are always so eager to show its muscles... I doubt the Chinese government can stop its own military from using force to take Taiwan.

I against any kind of war,but in my view war is unavoidable between mainland and taiwan, within 10 years mainland will launch campaign with taiwan. just goggle .

Originally Posted by Kinection

Another thing that I have heard from multiple people, including Taiwanese. The "assasination" attempt during the elections was a setup, #1 to freeze the votes of the military and #2 to sway voters.

Yes, I've found the same with my froends. Surely the Chinese would use an assassin that could do his/her job properly. If it was a proper assasination attempt why didn't the shooter(s) finish President Chen off?

To be an independent nation is im possible for Taiwan.US needs not a new nation but a chequer in his chessboard.89.5 percent Chinese agree to use military force to cut the knot.If in USA,F-16, F/A--18,F--15,A--10 won't shout in the sky????? Tai's leader pretends to fight for autocephaly,the just want more surportance in elections.If tai return ti Mainland ,China will be an overlord in aisa,and have more weight in the balance of U and C's relation.