Originally Posted by AikiRooster

Agreed, at least Hitler started it. Although, I am not sure how much the Japanese and Italians wanted it started as well. If Germany didn't try to fight two wars at same time, I think we possibly could be speaking German today. Although, I wonder if Germany had won ( can't believe I wrote one, I'm a stunod), would they have eventually fought Japan as well for total control?

The United States was also fighting a war on two fronts.

Germany defeated Poland because 1. It was a surprise attack 2. Poland's army was technologically inferior and its airforce was outgunned (Germany had 850 bombers and 400 fighters to Poland's 210 bombers and 150 fighters) and 3. The Soviet Union attacked Poland 2 weeks after Germany.

simple question simple answer,

Hitler

Seriously Hitler told Adm Reader to have a fleet ready to take on England in 1950 so he set about building a fleet, if Hitler told Adm Reader to be ready to fight in England in early 1939 Reader would have had over 300 U-Boats ready to strike England would have been cut off and would have died on the vine. Game over in the west.

The War was lost becuase the German navy was not ready to fight becuase they were told to get ready for a fight in 1950 so that is exactly what they were preparing to do. They did the best they could with what they had that is for sure.

Originally Posted by sfreincle

The United States was also fighting a war on two fronts.

Germany defeated Poland because 1. It was a surprise attack 2. Poland's army was technologically inferior and its airforce was outgunned (Germany had 850 bombers and 400 fighters to Poland's 210 bombers and 150 fighters) and 3. The Soviet Union attacked Poland 2 weeks after Germany.

Even had event #3 not happened, the Germans would have still conquered Poland. However, had the British and French attacked Germany as they had promised, things might have gone diffeerently.

face it WW2 was fought over toilet paper in the first place, We had it, the axis didn't, they wanted it, they invaded for it.

Originally Posted by Topmaul

simple question simple answer,

Hitler

Seriously Hitler told Adm Reader to have a fleet ready to take on England in 1950 so he set about building a fleet, if Hitler told Adm Reader to be ready to fight in England in early 1939 Reader would have had over 300 U-Boats ready to strike England would have been cut off and would have died on the vine. Game over in the west.

The War was lost becuase the German navy was not ready to fight becuase they were told to get ready for a fight in 1950 so that is exactly what they were preparing to do. They did the best they could with what they had that is for sure.

With the loss of England if Germany attacked Russia they would have perhaps won, there would have been no strategic bombing of Germany itself German war production would have been much greater than it was with intact German factories cranking out weapons of war.

But Der Furrer forgot to let the Navy in on the master plan.

The invasion of the UK was never really part of any master plan by Germany, it was even hoped by Hitler that they might collaborate. Acquiring land particularly in the East was more ideologically sound to them. The navy was also restricted by various agreements. Although Hitler and even the previous Weimar republic payed lip service to these they still wished to expand ostensibly.

Originally Posted by perseus

The invasion of the UK was never really part of any master plan by Germany, it was even hoped by Hitler that they might collaborate. Acquiring land particularly in the East was more ideologically sound to them.

However, Germans created idea of `Sea Lion`, while they were in the war with UK. Yes, they didn't actually develop this idea further, instead they use it to disguise Soviet intelligence regarding operation `Barbarossa`.

Originally Posted by Topmaul

The War was lost becuase the German navy was not ready to fight becuase they were told to get ready for a fight in 1950 so that is exactly what they were preparing to do. They did the best they could with what they had that is for sure.

A bit too easy IMO to blame it only on the navy. Figure the amount of soldiers tied up on the Northern Flank in the attempt to take Murmansk by land... The Northern Flank was stalemate until Finland changed allies and declared war on Germany - the German troops had to retreat during harsh conditions and by foot through Finland into Norway to reach transportation to Germany. A couple of divisions that did nothing but shivering of cold in their trenches and dying while walking.

Germany had 400,000 combat ready troops in Norway due to Hitlers obsession of Festung Europe and Festung Norwegen, where as many as 80,000 German troops was tied up on on the large number of costal defences scattering the Norwegian coastline (approx 320,000 troops ready to go); Hitler refused to deploy these troops to Europe in 1944-1945 as he believed the final battle would be in Scandinavia and that the allied invasion in Normandie was a cover operation for the allied invasion of Norway (which never came...)

Just a couple of arguments for not blaming the German navy alone. The overall picture is FUBAR complex.

Originally Posted by perseus

The invasion of the UK was never really part of any master plan by Germany, it was even hoped by Hitler that they might collaborate. Acquiring land particularly in the East was more ideologically sound to them. The navy was also restricted by various agreements. Although Hitler and even the previous Weimar republic payed lip service to these they still wished to expand ostensibly.

An interesting side note is that Hitler actually admired Britain and even more so, its history when it was the British Empire. He read much about its conquests and studied its strategies in the hope of gaining insights into the establishment of an empire. It was later revealed that he secretly hoped to ally the Third Reich with London, but thank God, Churchill wasn't buying.

Hitler wasn't stupid, of course he admired the British Empire, who wouldn't? I mean come on back in the day the sun never set on the British Empire. Admiration for your enemy is a sign that you have honor. I always had a little admiration for my enemy, respect too, I also read as much and learned as much as possible from and about my enemy, made me a better fighter. Look at Patton, read Romels book about the tank in battle and kicked his butt.