Originally Posted by Redleg

I have deleted my own post..
And I agree that some of what he says does have some kind of merit, but the wording could have been a bit different..

I understand what he meant as well (even if it was a bit jingoistic), but if the 2 events I mentioned had turned out differently there wouldn't have likely been an Anglo Saxon British Empire and therefore things in the USA would have worked out FAR differently.

One outcome is that North America today might have been predominantly muslim.

Interesting huh?

Another really decisive battle was the battle of Chalons that took place in 451AD between Atilla's huns and the combined forces of the Roman General Aetius and the Visigoths comanded by King Theodoric. They managed to envelop the Hunnish armies who had, up until then, laid waste to everything in their path. The Huns lost over 200000 men in that one battle alone and it was the beginning of the end of the conquest of Europe by the 'Scourge of God' Atilla.

agreed

1st what if they arabs have controled europe? btw arabs arent all terrorist they have asmuch culture as northamericans ( that arent arab lol) and they probably have more...

2nd the world would have been in chaos if the british would have won the independance? lollllllll

Originally Posted by Jtf2

1st what if they arabs have controled europe? btw arabs arent all terrorist they have asmuch culture as northamericans ( that arent arab lol) and they probably have more...

Since when is culture quantifiable?

Stay on topic. (the above is a rhetorical question )

Originally Posted by Jtf2

1st what if they arabs have controled europe? btw arabs arent all terrorist they have asmuch culture as northamericans ( that arent arab lol) and they probably have more...

2nd the world would have been in chaos if the british would have won the independance? lollllllll

I didn't pass any judgement on what a muslim Europe and North America would be like. I happen to have a great deal of respect for other faiths (I'm Christian although I'm not really religious) and in no way was Attila the Hun or Ghengis Khan the bloodthirsty savages many in the west have made them out to be. Both were very intelligent men and Ghengis Khan in particular was a great administrator and very tolerant once he had conquered you

But given today's current clashes in the Middle East/Iraq it would have been very different had the outcome of those 2 events gone differently. Kim Stanley Robertson wrote a very interesting book called "The Years of Rice and Salt" which explored a world without Christians and where Islam and Buddahism dominated. Worth reading!

Originally Posted by doppleganger

Kim Stanley Robertson wrote a very interesting book called "The Years of Rice and Salt" which explored a world without Christians and where Islam and Buddahism dominated. Worth reading!

While I am not a huge fan of alternative history, I have to agree, this is a book well worth reading.

i agree that the spartens when they fought to hold off the persains was very important but if it was not for the Allies winning the battle of normady we would all be speaking german or japaness

Originally Posted by goaliedude66630

i agree that the spartens when they fought to hold off the persains was very important but if it was not for the Allies winning the battle of normady we would all be speaking german or japaness

Hey there. Have a look at the Turning Point of WW2 thread for my take on what you said about the Battle of Normandy. It was a big campaign no doubt but other battles in WW2 had *far* more influence.

[quote="JaegerWolf08"]I was thinking the Battle of Austerlitz...[\quote]

That would be the "Battle of Nations", correct?

Being a Navy freak, I would say either the Battle of Trafalgar or the Battle of Yorktown. Trafalgar smashed a country's navy and crippled it for good...sorry, but the French Navy isn't the greatest even today.

Yorktown was an excellent joint land-sea mission that ended up in a liberated United States.

Just my humble opinion...

I don't know the name of the battle, but I saw a picture of it once. It was between the invading Mongols and the Russians. Something like 500,000 people dies that day. I actually saw a picture of it once. Anyone know the name?