Originally Posted by MontyB

Hehe I was amazed by the number of people in the picture, I didn't realise we had that many in the country in 1945 let alone Wellington.

Looks like all of wellington turned up

What intrigues me is this comment:

New Zealand was involved for all but three of the 2179 days of the war

What 3 days did we take off?

Since we declared war at the same time as Britain I can only assume we ended the war with Japan 3 days early or maybe we took a long weekend in the middle somewhere for a BBQ?

Originally Posted by LeEnfield

This takes me back a few years, I remember going into London to celebrate VE day and the whole thing was quite wild, I was in the crowds in the front of Buckingham Palace and I was all around the west end. A few days later the blackout was ended and the streets lights came back on, which seemed so odd as they had been switched off for a greater part of my life. Also it ended that period when you saw a lad come to school with a long face only to be told which member of his family he had just lost. Although the war was not over the writing was on the wall and we all looked forwarded to better things, mind you it took quite a few years before things started to improve

I can only imagine the joy and elation experienced on VE day. No more bombing, no more V1's, no more V2's and the end of the blackout after 6 long years of war. But then the sadness of those not coming home.

Originally Posted by MontyB

I cant imagine that VE day is "celebrated" in Germany but is it acknowledged at all (other than personal events as you have mentioned here)?

New Zealand only tends to commemorate Armistice day in November and ANZAC day in April which is used as remembrance day for all wars.

No, that's just sentimental old fools like me who remember old war comrades that day. To most Germans it is a day which should not be celebrated, but whose reasons and effects should be contemplated. Mind, I am talking about how Germany handles this day, not the Allies. You guys have every reason to celebrate. 8 May marked the end of one of history's most cruel dictatorships, but it also marked something else but the liberation from Nazism:

Between 12 to 14 million German civilians were driven from their homes. Two million of them did die trying to reach what remained of Germany, many of them were outright murdered in acts of revenge no less barbarous than those the Nazis had committed.

Hundreds of thousands of women and girls became subject to rape, especially committed by the Soviet occupation troops. Celebrating 8 May in this regard is like celebrating "Rape Your Gandma" Day!

Germany was 'liberated' of its full sovereignity for 45 years. Some say it still does not fully have it back.

Germany was cut apart and became the plaything of two superpowers as well as the doomed battleground of a possible future nuclear war.

We can be most happy that Nazism belongs to the dustbin of history. But nobody can force the Germans to celebrate what it did cost Germany and the Germans to get to this point. Nothing better than the end of Nazism, and the end of the Nazi crimes, could have happened to Germany and the Germans. And the allied nations have every right to celebrate their victory. But given what the day meant for Germany, given what getting there did cost us! Do not expect Germans to celebrate that.

This is still a widespread attitude among Germans.

As I mentioned I did not expect that Germany would celebrate VE day, it seems only New Zealand and Australia commemorate defeats in the form of ANZAC day but despite the disaster of Gallipoli it did form our national identity and it is the ideal day to remember the sacrifices made in getting us to this point.

I guess what I was getting at rather clumsily was whether Germany had some form of remembrance day (not necessarily WW2 related).

We have a "Volkstrauertag" (people's mourning day) the second from last Sunday before the first day of Advent. Remembering those that died in the wars and under suppressive governments. The VE day itself is not observed in Germany.

Der Alte

When you mentioned about the numbers of Germans dispossessed you failed to mention that a large area of occupied countries was designated a Greater Germany and the people from these countries were thrown off there farms and out of their business and they were handed over to German immigrants for nothing, and they were helped by Germans that already lived there so was any surprise that when Germany lost the war these people were forced out.

Now as a lad I met quite a number of German POW and quite liked them and when a local vicar went on about killing Germans I refused to be confirmed in that church, so it is not out of dislike for the Germans I pass these comments.

Now there was a lot rape and murder through out Eastern Europe and is it any wonder that troops from that area paid you back in kind.

As far as remembering the men you fought with and shared all the horrors of war, then personally I have no objections, The German soldier on the whole was brave man and stood his ground well. When you compare what happen in Eastern Europe to what happened in the Western Desert there is no comparison.

Originally Posted by MontyB

What intrigues me is this comment:


What 3 days did we take off?

Since we declared war at the same time as Britain I can only assume we ended the war with Japan 3 days early or maybe we took a long weekend in the middle somewhere for a BBQ?

probably a rugby game with the Aussies

One night in Egypt mightent count

Originally Posted by LeEnfield

Der Alte

When you mentioned about the numbers of Germans dispossessed you failed to mention that a large area of occupied countries was designated a Greater Germany and the people from these countries were thrown off there farms and out of their business and they were handed over to German immigrants for nothing, and they were helped by Germans that already lived there so was any surprise that when Germany lost the war these people were forced out.

Now as a lad I met quite a number of German POW and quite liked them and when a local vicar went on about killing Germans I refused to be confirmed in that church, so it is not out of dislike for the Germans I pass these comments.

Now there was a lot rape and murder through out Eastern Europe and is it any wonder that troops from that area paid you back in kind.

As far as remembering the men you fought with and shared all the horrors of war, then personally I have no objections, The German soldier on the whole was brave man and stood his ground well. When you compare what happen in Eastern Europe to what happened in the Western Desert there is no comparison.

I do not disagree with you.
It was the general opinion amongst the Germans I expressed.

The war still hurts Germans my age. There are still some who hate the English and Americans because of the "terror bombing" of German cities.