im not talking about the waffen ss totenkompf, the concetration camp guards, im talking about the line units that where probably the best line units of world war 2. any thoughts on them as a whole? i understand that they commited horrible atrocities, but i dont think we should judge what happened in ww2, particularly regarding the russians and germans, which is where ww2 was really fought. anyways, any thoughts on the ss as a fighting unit? like i said earlier, i consider them as a whole the best line units in ww2.

You're referring to the military wing of the SS which was the Waffen SS. They came under Heer (Army) command and were deployed alongside the Heer as part of the Wehrmacht. In general they were very tough and effective units and as good as the best Heer formations. They were involved in all the major Eastern Front battles and indeed it was the II SS Panzer Korps that Erich von Manstein used to spearhead his brilliant recapture of Kharkov in 1943 and so save Armeegruppe Sud (Army Group South) from collapse.

Incidentally, the SS Division you mentioned, Totenkopf or 3rd SS Panzer Division, was one of those front line formations and formed part of the II SS Panzer Korps as stated above. You might find the attached link useful:

http://www.feldgrau.com/iissk.html

BTW all Armies committed atrocities in WW2, such is the nature of war.

The Waffen-SS mainadvantage in battle came from the fact that they received the best equipment and the best training available to the Germans. One could also say that because they were volunteers, their motivation was also top notch.

This is not however true in every case, and usually distinctions were made between the freiwillige and the native German units. The SS-units that served in the Balkans for example were not much different from standard Wehrmacht infantry divisions or could even be equipped much worse.

Originally Posted by Hegario

The Waffen-SS mainadvantage in battle came from the fact that they received the best equipment and the best training available to the Germans. One could also say that because they were volunteers, their motivation was also top notch.

This is not however true in every case, and usually distinctions were made between the freiwillige and the native German units. The SS-units that served in the Balkans for example were not much different from standard Wehrmacht infantry divisions or could even be equipped much worse.

It's been established that it was a myth that the SS Divisions received better equipment than the regular Heer units. In fact, the elite Heer Panzer or Panzergrenadier divisions, like Panzer-Lehr Division for example, sometimes received new replacements first. The first German division to receive Royal Tigers was a Heer and not an SS Division.

The Waffen SS began as an all-volunteer strictly German force with very high standards. Of course as the war went on and the native German manpower pool dwindled, they had to relax their requirements and so you had a number of European SS formations or non Germans fighting in the German SS formations.

my gandpa was in the waffen ss. if you wanted to join them in the early years of war, you had to pass many physical tests. later from 1943 on they took everybody who wanted to join.
but the original units received an elite training. It was a matter of honour for the waffen ss members never to retreat, but to win or to die. So every regular army calmed down, and fought with a higher motivation, if they knew that a waffen ss unit was near. They knew if they come into trouble, the waffen ss would get them out.
for the members of the waffen ss war was a personal thing, so i think you cant compare them with normal units, because they lived to fight and die for hitler.

Waffe ss troops and the panzer grendiers are the most elite troops in the german army, and during kursk they almost wont the battle near prohvapoka, but because of the german command, they lost the battle due to a counter-offensive, anyz, my point is that with good supply and leadership. waffen ss and panzer grendiers would own onthe eastern front

...which is where ww2 was really fought

I don't think that was very fair...

im sorry.

Waffen SS, the first real Eurocorps, multinational army of the United Europe.

Waffen SS Division Wiking had heavy losses on the eastern front and was litterally shot to pieces, although beside this "incident" I reckon Waffen SS as perhaps the best fighting corps the world ever seen since the days of Alexander the Great.