New York Post
December 3, 2007
America has the right to kidnap British citizens if they are wanted for crimes in the United States, Washington has told Britain.
A senior lawyer for the US government has told the Court of Appeal in London that kidnapping foreign citizens is permissible under American law because the US Supreme Court has sanctioned it.
The admission will alarm the British business community after the case of the so-called NatWest Three, bankers who were extradited to America on fraud charges.
More than a dozen other British executives, including senior managers at British Airways and BAE Systems, are under investigation by US authorities and could face criminal charges in America.
Until now, it was commonly assumed that US law permitted kidnapping only in the “extraordinary rendition” of terrorist suspects.
The American government has for the first time made it clear in a British court that the law applies to anyone, British or otherwise, suspected of a crime by Washington.
Legal experts confirmed over the weekend that America viewed extradition as just one way of getting foreign suspects back to face trial.
The US government’s view emerged during a hearing involving Stanley Tollman and his wife, Beatrice. The Tollmans, who control the Red Carnation hotel group and are residents of London, are wanted in the United States for bank fraud and tax evasion.
--Times of London

wow.....just, wow

Originally Posted by Infern0

wow.....just, wow

Well, it's about time that Great Britain (and the rest of the Earth minus the USA) got her comeuppance.
The Governments on Earth (minus the USA) are either with us or against us, and, I'd like to point out that it is just as easy to bring the pain to England, as it was to "Shock and Awe" Iraq, as a matter of fact, I'd say we have better maps of England than we had of Iraq before the new War there.

Someone has to drive this bus called Earth, someone has to be in charge of things.... even though the rest of the World cannot Vote in US Elections..... Republicans will show the rest of the World the path to Heaven, while they attempt to build Heaven on Earth.... albeit merely the Republican view of Heaven on Earth.

Is the UK really going to stand for this? I doubt very much Americans would approve of British cops kidnapping people here.

Originally Posted by major liability

Is the UK really going to stand for this? I doubt very much Americans would approve of British cops kidnapping people here.

Microsoft just had a case before the Courts in the EU, I for one wouldn't mind in the least seeing what would happen if the Brits (or another EU Member) came to the USA and kidnapped Bill Gates, took him to England (or some other EU Member State) and tossed him in jail on some violations of EU Law.

Originally Posted by Gator

Well, it's about time that Great Britain (and the rest of the Earth minus the USA) got her comeuppance.
The Governments on Earth (minus the USA) are either with us or against us, and, I'd like to point out that it is just as easy to bring the pain to England, as it was to "Shock and Awe" Iraq, as a matter of fact, I'd say we have better maps of England than we had of Iraq before the new War there.

------------------------------------------------------


Our boys are still dying in Iraq and Afghanistan with our allies and I have to read more horse-**** from the above .
Here we have the latest broadcast of complete BS from the but I think we can just relegate that to the cess-pit, where it belongs.

Good - got that off my chest. Better now. Red mist clearing.


Now, regarding the thread, I have to say that countries who avoid or refuse to extradite villains always get right up my nose. For example, we won't send back criminals to countries which still have the death penalty, or can stand accused of torture. This can be a grey area, and villains take advantage of this and head here. When there is a good case against them we should ship 'em off, whatever.

I think that if USA wants certain people extradited from here, it should be no problem, of course under set arrangements. That way no confrontation would arise. And vice-versa certainly. We are supposed to be allies, ain't we?

I feel that the very fact that the USA has made this point is a "slap in the face" to the UK and deserves to be treated as such.

This shows a complete and utter disregard for another countries sovereignty. No country needs "allies" who treat them like that.

Originally Posted by Gator

Well, it's about time that Great Britain (and the rest of the Earth minus the USA) got her comeuppance.
The Governments on Earth (minus the USA) are either with us or against us, and, I'd like to point out that it is just as easy to bring the pain to England, as it was to "Shock and Awe" Iraq, as a matter of fact, I'd say we have better maps of England than we had of Iraq before the new War there.

Someone has to drive this bus called Earth, someone has to be in charge of things.... even though the rest of the World cannot Vote in US Elections..... Republicans will show the rest of the World the path to Heaven, while they attempt to build Heaven on Earth.... albeit merely the Republican view of Heaven on Earth.

Haha, sadly though I don't trust my own politicians to run this country I will be buggered if I plan to let yours do it instead.

However you make a good point if the USA is making laws that affect the world then I would suggest that the world should get a say in who is making these laws, perhaps a worldwide internet vote for the next US administration?



Anyway on to the point at hand, I think you will find that this "senior lawyer" is merely stating a point that is "theoretically" accurate rather than an actual likelihood as any attempts at kidnapping would severely strain relations and put US citizens at risk of similar treatment which is not something either side would intentionally do I believe.

Originally Posted by MontyB

Haha, sadly though I don't trust my own politicians to run this country I will be buggered if I plan to let yours do it instead.

However you make a good point if the USA is making laws that affect the world then I would suggest that the world should get a say in who is making these laws, perhaps a worldwide internet vote for the next US administration?

You think you have poor Politicians?
There are many here in the USA.... Local, County, State, and Federal.

As for the case in England, well, I thought it was against the Law in England to kidnap a UK Citizen, and if it is still so, well, England can always attack the United States of America if we ever do the deed, and get caught at it.
Or, the EU can cut off all Trade, stop all EU Money going into the Stock Market here, call in any Debts owed, and work overtime driving down the US Dollar if they are upset about it.

I know we have poor politicians I suspect it would rate pretty close to the least trusted profession worldwide and lets face it all the professions that our politicians had before taking up the role would fill the next 10 least trusted spots.
Funny how all the poli's people like tend to fill the lowest spots in government because they rarely tow the party line.

Any way I am not overly concerned by these comments as I think they are symptomatic of the current US administration and as that will be changing over the next 12 months I don't think it should be taken seriously as regardless of who is elected I suspect foreign policy will be altering markedly after the election.

Hell even the Aussies are signed up to Kyoto now.