Del Boy

I believe you missed the hint of sarcasm in Gator's post, the last two sentences give it away. Only a true Neocon actually believes in the USA's right to rendition people without contacting local government.

Senorjekips

Please understand that the views of the Bush Administration, the Neo-conservatives and the other rightwing fruitcakes currently in power do not represent the overwhelming majority of Americans who believe not only in rule of law but in respecting other countries national sovereignty.

There will be a day of reckoning...

[quote=mmarsh;382818]Del Boy

I believe you missed the hint of sarcasm in Gator's post, the last two sentences give it away. Only a true Neocon actually believes in the USA's right to rendition people without contacting local government.

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MM - thanks for pointing that out. However, as you know, I do try to be careful, and you will see that my post picked out the comments that bothered me and mine specifically. It was particularly unacceptable, and it is not the first time that he has taken the opportunity to slag off Britain and England in unbelievably vitriolic terms. Some attitudes have to be challenged, and this guy does not fool me. Every time he sticks his head above the parapet in such specifics I will jump. BUT - I will only be re-active, and do not have a confrontational agenda. My point is - just do not insult the nation, the people and the fighting forces of your allies unless you want Trouble with a capital T.
But thanks again for your consideration.

Del Boy.

No problemo.

I am in a very bad mood today because of the latest development in Iran (see other thread) but this is exactly the reason why.

I mean the ARROGANCE and IRRESPONSIBILITY of these people to say that they have the right to do whatever they want, wherever they want, because they are the US Government is so embarrassing to ordinary US citizens (especially those abroad) I feel like telling most people that I am Canadian just in order to disassociate myself with them.

I mean look at the U.S posters here at milforum, I don't think you will find one American (Liberal or Conservative) here who would agree with that statement, as its such an odious thing to say.

And then people wonder why we have no friends in the world...

It's the danger of groupthink. It is important that you step out of your own group and try to listen to others who disagree with you. It's good to talk to people you agree with but I think you learn more from people who disagree with you. Then you will be able to approach different problems from angles that you never thought of.
Personally the thing that gets me about neo-cons is that they rarely ever seem to go through the trouble of carrying out their "ideas" themselves. It's always "send in the troops!" But when I was in college, I never met one neo-con with true intent to enlist at any capacity.
If the US can kidnap wanted suspects in the UK, the same should apply vice versa.

MM - thanks again. You and i will find ourselves taking opposing views on the Iran question - but remember that we are coming from different directions. i take a very general look and see and speak at the same time type of assessment, almost like setting a starting point for the opinion I have developed at the very ground level. Barrack room perhaps? You have specialised and personal views of your own government and you are sensitive to the views of those outside your country. But anyone who stands up to be counted, as USA does, is hated in this world, reason is not required, I feel.

I cannot go with the crowd, I believe it produces the worst of man. Can I recommend Ayn Rand - I bet I can't do that to you my friend, and I haven't read The Fountainhead for 25 years. I also have done the shop-steward, strike committee roles, but I was only just out of teens then. I have a socialist background - but now I am grown-up and don't know where I am on that scale.

So please understand that when I hazard an opinion it is just me considering situations for what it is worth. So if we come up with absolutely opposite takes sometimes it is nothing personal. and it's good to present both sides of the coin.

And don't take being hated too hard, it can be the red badge of courage, and always remember what the great man said - 'everybody must get stoned'. It is just a pain.

And remember that I have no experience of Neo-cons or even Christian extremes. We are very tolerant of such matters here.

Originally Posted by the_13th_redneck

If the US can kidnap wanted suspects in the UK, the same should apply vice versa.

If the people are bad enough we'll get off our butts and go kidnap them then they deserve it. People shouldn't be able to go out of the country and "be safe." They should be hunted anywhere, IMO.

And I don't think we should keep other countries criminals hidden either. They person knew when they committed a crime (I'm talking about a serious crime, not stealing bread so the family doesn't starve) in their country what the consequences were). Pack'em up and ship'em out IMHO. We have enough crappy people to deal with here than to keep other countries criminals because their laws "aren't nice."

P.S. The UK should come clean up the bad guys they have over here.