Topic: The Top Military Powers 20 Years From Now

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February 2nd, 2007   Post 1
Mokhaberat
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Post; The Top Military Powers 20 Years From Now


Who will be the big world powers twenty years from now? This is a difficult prediction to make, largely because in 20 years, many unexpected changes could take place. For example, two decades ago, the United States and Soviet Union were locked in a Cold War. Nobody expected that in five years from then, the Berlin Wall would fall and the Soviet Union would literally disintegrate. That said, there is an idea of who is emerging, and who is fading.

10. Brazil – This country is emerging as the dominant military and economic force in Latin America. It operates the only aircraft carrier outside the US Navy in the Western Hemisphere. Currently, Brazil is trying to build up its forces still more, and is pursuing a program to build a nuclear-powered attack submarine and could be pursuing nuclear weapons development as well.

9. South Korea – This country has an indigenous naval program that is quite solid, and one of the better armies in the world. The only thing holding it back is a reliance on foreign designs for aircraft, although it is manufacturing F-16s locally.

8. Germany – Despite reductions in the German defense budget after the end of the Cold War, this military has several quality systems (like the Leopard 2 main battle tank and the Type 212 submarine). Germany also has had a tradition of effective military forces (just ask the Romans).

7. Japan – This is a country which has, with one hand tied behind its back, developed the number two navy in the Pacific Rim, and arguably the second-best air force (tied with China). The only thing that holds Japan back is an apparent lack of desire. Things could rapidly change on that front, though.
6. Russia – This country has a lot of nukes, and a lot of bombers. While naval designs (like the Kirov-class battlecruisers and Oscar-class submarines) are good on paper, they still have quality issues, and accidents are not unheard of. Still, this is a country that has some advantages, and is no pushover.
5. France – Probably in better shape than what one would expect. This is largely because of the quality of the troops (due to career NCOs). Has remained self-sufficient in terms of producing major weapons systems (see the Rafale), and operates the only CVN outside the U.S. Navy (even though it has had problems).
4. China – This is a force that has quantity on its side, and is rapidly trying to improve its quality. Their air force will probably have the largest force of Su-27 fighters in the world (at least 580, compared to the 550 in Russian service). The Chinese navy is rapidly introducing new classed of destroyers and frigates that are close to the quality of American and Japanese surface combatants. That said, it is still behind, and the Chinese financial situation could go downhill rapidly.
3. UK – While small, this is a force that not only had a tradition of high quality, it has proven as recently as 1982 that it can operate half a world away and still accomplish a difficult mission. Sailor for sailor, there is no better navy than the Royal Navy.

2. India – Probably the most dynamic country in terms of the leaps. India is rapidly becoming self-sufficient in a number of areas, and what it cannot produce, it is able to buy. It also has some of the best training in the world, and can give an unsuspecting opponent a surprise. Probably the next superpower due to a more firm economic footing, and the fact that its Navy is much more advanced than China’s.
1. USA – Even while fighting a war on terrorism, the United States is pursuing new technology (such as UCAVs) to maintain an edge over any potential challenger. The forces are well-trained, and the United States Navy is still the most powerful in the world. The term superpower almost understates what the United States can do – it is arguably a hyperpower. I think that the United States will stay a hyperpower, another 20 to 50 years from now.

Last edited by Mokhaberat; February 2nd, 2007 at 23:19.
 
February 2nd, 2007   Post 2
bulldogg
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Gotta say from the chatter I get from soldiers serving or who have served in the ROK forces, its a paper tiger. I mean no disrespect to our South Korean brethren but equipment is neglected, training is becoming lacsidaisical and South Korean boys will go to no end to avoid serving in their own country's military for just two years.
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February 2nd, 2007   Post 3
Mokhaberat
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Post; Neglet


Quote:
Originally Posted by bulldogg
Gotta say from the chatter I get from soldiers serving or who have served in the ROK forces, its a paper tiger. I mean no disrespect to our South Korean brethren but equipment is neglected, training is becoming lacsidaisical and South Korean boys will go to no end to avoid serving in their own country's military for just two years.
I got to say your right, South Korean military has neglected its equipment and its training with all do respect to the South Korean brothers of freedom. But it still has an indigenous naval program that is quite solid. And it has one of the better armies in the world.

Last edited by Mokhaberat; February 2nd, 2007 at 23:44. Reason: forgot to add somthing
 
February 3rd, 2007   Post 4
bulldogg
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Gear


I think one force you need to add to this list is Israel. They are as strong today as they have ever been and their weapons programmes in terms of procurement and development are above par.
 
February 3rd, 2007   Post 5
weed
Optio
 
 
Have to agree with Israel being on the list. What about the EU's Eurocorps? With a single currency, no borders, and trying to ratify a constitution, Europe is on it's way to becoming the United States of Europe. That could make for quite the military machine. May sound a bit fanciful now, but the makings are there. Just some food for thought.

http://www.eurocorps.net/home/
 
February 3rd, 2007   Post 6
CABAL
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Gear

Harold C. Hutchison's list is inadequate and vague, Libyan General please quote your sources after posting this list. The list mention nothing about Power projection. Power comes from Power itself. NOT Cultural dynamics, dreams of self-suffeciency, economic predictions, and other prejudices. In addition, it appears that Mr. Hutchison have failed to cite his sources to proove his assertions.

Source of your article: http://www.strategypage.com/dls/arti...0551803352.asp


1. "Israel needs to be on the list", should I need to say any further?
2. The Indian military is indeed the most powerful militaries in the world but it has a very antiquated air-force, underdeveloped C4ISR system, and is not self-suffecient in providing its own sophisticated weapons systems. The Arjun Tank is an example of their sluggish progress in self-suffeciency and often relied on weapons imports, making them among the top importers.
3. China should not be overtaken by India if they are actually demonstrating their ability to make enormous leaps economically and technologically. An example of their latest show of strength is their ASAT test. Economic slowdowns is a controversial subject and should not be used to proove a Nation's military power because of its theoretical implications.
4. The Russian military is seriously underrated. This perception of mocking Russian Hardware by labeling it as "poor quality" needs to be stopped. Words such as "quality issues" and the "Russian Military" do not share the same meaning. The reasons why there are unfortunate accidents, notably the Russian Navy, is because of poor maintanence.
5. It is difficult and merely impossible to determine the top miliaries in the world without fighting an actual war with each other.
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Last edited by CABAL; February 3rd, 2007 at 21:50.
 
February 3rd, 2007   Post 7
Mokhaberat
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Post; hyperpower


Quote:
Originally Posted by CABAL
Harold C. Hutchison's list is inadequate and vague, Libyan General please quote your sources after posting this list. The list mention nothing about Power projection. Power comes from Power itself. NOT Cultural dynamics, dreams of self-suffeciency, economic predictions, and other prejudices. In addition, it appears that Mr. Hutchison have failed to cite his sources to proove his assertions.

Source of your article: http://www.strategypage.com/dls/arti...0551803352.asp


1. "Israel needs to be on the list", should I need to say any further?
2. The Indian military is indeed the most powerful militaries in the world but it has a very antiquated air-force, underdeveloped C4ISR system, and is not self-suffecient in providing its own sophisticated weapons systems. The Arjun Tank is an example of their sluggish progress in self-suffeciency and often relied on weapons imports, making them among the top importers.
3. China should not be overtaken by India if they are actually demonstrating their ability to make enormous leaps economically and technologically. An example of their latest show of strength is their ASAT test. Economic slowdowns is a controversial subject and should not be used to proove a Nation's military power because of its theoretical implications.
4. The Russian military is seriously underrated. This perception of mocking Russian Hardware by labeling it as "poor quality" needs to be stopped. Words such as "quality issues" and the "Russian Military" do not share the same meaning. The reasons why there are unfortunate accidents, notably the Russian Navy, is because of poor maintanence.
5. It is difficult and merely impossible to determine the top miliaries in the world without fighting an actual war with each other.
The United States Military aid relationship with Israel is unlike any other in the world, or indeed, like any in history. In sheervolume, the amount of aid is the most generous foreign-aid program ever between any two countries, totaling $200.526billion through fiscal year 2005. No country, including South Vietnam, has ever received as much congressionally mandated aid as has Israel. Indeed, Israel receives more U.S. Military aid per capita annually than the total annual GNP per capita of several Arab states, including Egypt, Mauritania, Sudan, Yemen and Morocco. What is perhaps even more unusual is that Israel, like its benefactor, is an advanced, industrialized, technologically sophisticated country, as well as a major arms exporter.Israel ranks as the sixteenth wealthiest country in the world; Israelis enjoy a higher per capita income than oil-rich Saudi Arabia and are only slightly less well-off than most Western European countries.
AID does not term economic aid to Israel as development assistance, but instead uses the term "economic And Military support funding." Given Israel's relative prosperity, U.S. aid to Israel is becoming increasingly controversial. So i dont think that Israel should be on the list. Why becous it alredy Holds more then 300 Nuks if my Military Intel is right. Its a unknown hyperpower. in the world, With all do respect to Israel And to who reads this.
 
February 4th, 2007   Post 8
CABAL
Primus Pilus
 
 
Gear

Mokhaberat

Yes and because of this aide, it propelled Israel into a major power in the Middle East. However Israel does not have an effective Blue Water navy nor does have an effective Expeditionary force that can enable them to project power beyond this region. Unlike the United States, Israel's political, military, and economic influence is limited to the Middle East therefore making it a regional power instead rather than a Superpower.
 
February 4th, 2007   Post 9
Fox
Can you hear me now?
 
 
Gear

Those lists are pretty interesting but I agree to the people that think Israel should be in the lists. Well-trained soldiers, and pilots.
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February 4th, 2007   Post 10
Mokhaberat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CABAL
Mokhaberat

Yes and because of this aide, it propelled Israel into a major power in the Middle East. However Israel does not have an effective Blue Water navy nor does have an effective Expeditionary force that can enable them to project power beyond this region. Unlike the United States, Israel's political, military, and economic influence is limited to the Middle East therefore making it a regional power instead rather than a Superpower.
You know, After all this what i was saying is that Israel is already superpower but unknown to the world, And yes it should be on the list, So your right.
 



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