About Taliban, terrorist or self-defense? Page 2
|April 21st, 2010||#11|
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Have you ever looked into the history of Afghanistan mate ???
I know there has been a lot of talk about the British' wars in Afghanistan and so on, but I what I am referring to is post WW2 and pre Soviet Invasion.
If you had taken the time to research a little about the history of the country, you would have found that Afghanistan, in that period of time was perhahs the muslim country, closest to Western society.
After ten years of war with the Russians, Russia finally didn't feel welcome anymore, and left in 1989. The country was left decimated and utterly in chaos.
During the period of Russian occupation between 600.000 and 2.000.000 Afghans were killed. Over 5.000.000 fled to Pakistan and Iran.
Does this alone not justify an intervention by Western society???
We've done it in Africa, The Balkans etc.. - no one complained then ...
Then followed a period of civil war - which didn't really help the country out of its decayed state.
Then came the Taliban - they did indeed instill some sort of law and order.
Problem was the issue with the whole human rights thing...
Why can't you execute people publicly in the following way; halftime at football matches, hang them from the few still standing street signs, execute them in the Olympic pool in Kabul, etc. etc. etc.
Oh btw. did I mention the ban of alcohol, music, singing, dancing, kite-flying, women holding jobs, girls going to school etc. etc. etc.
Do any of these facts justify an intervention by the rest of the world ???
I believe so - I take it you are not going to agree with me - but just as you are entitled to state you opinion - so am I.
Good luck on this site - I am not sure why or what reasons you have for joining Military Forum, seing as you have a clear Anti-Military message you want to express. But anyway - that is your right.
|April 21st, 2010||#12|
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God complex? I don't have a god complex, I am a god!
|April 21st, 2010||#13|
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I think your view is simplistic to say the least,.... and we are certainly not there to bring democracy to the people or to bring about personal freedoms as you seemingly suggest.
|April 21st, 2010||#14|
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Governments tend to play fast and loose with the definition of "terrorist." Just among U.S. agencies and organizations, different definitions are in use that essentially allow these different agencies to stay relevant in contemporary times. That said, I'm a big advocate of looking to academia as a source of clear-headed and logical approaches to terrorism, the first of which is developing a working definition that is neither too specific nor too broad.
Here is what I believe to be the best working definition of terrorism out there today, taken from Dr. Craig Stapley of Kansas State University:
"Terrorism is politically or ideologically-motivated violence or the threat of violence against non-combatants or property with the purpose of influencing a larger audience than the target."
Do the Taliban kill civilians to influence populations to abandon support of NATO forces? Yes. Ergo, they are terrorists.
|April 21st, 2010||#15|
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What crimes, in the cases of China and North Korea, are you referring to if I might ask??
Sentecing criminals to the death - and executing them - is that it ?
Last time I looked, the US still use the death penalty in several states too - why haven't you "invaded" those states and set things straight ?
Anyway I personally don't think you can compare, sentecing a murderer to death in China, and making a spectacle at halftime of a football match, of the execution of a woman accused (never tried in court - because - well there were no courts) of adultry, or hanging a man for not having a long enough beard.
Oh and last time I looked China and North Korea didn't have any plans of outlawing everyday things like music, tv, etc.
I know they use a lot of censorship, but there is a big difference from only being able to see "National tv" to being executed for owning a radio or a tv...
Well my opinion might be simplistic to you - but let me ask you this - ever been to Afghanistan mate ? Have you seen what it is like and what it was like before ?
In the mind of this Veteran of OEF/ISAF we ARE bringing personal freedom and democracy. We ARE making a difference - it might be slow, and painful, but we do good things.
I have seen it with my own eyes - I have heard Afghans telling how the Taliban killed their village' only teacher for teaching girls. How they killed their village elders for not giving them any food.
I have seen how schools have been rebuild, and how girls have started going to school - That is how I know we make a difference.
I cannot see how you can compare Afghanistan with China or North Korea in any way. Tell me why and how you can compare Afghanistan to those countries ?? Two communist countries still living in the cold war, and afghanistan who have been bombed back to the middle ages by 3 decades of war.
Seriously mate - I don't see the links.
I appreciate the first part of your answer on the subject, SENOJEKIPS, but we do obviously not agree.
But I do NOT appreciate you calling my opinion simplistic - yes we have different opinions - but why attack mine ?
Tell me mate - what experience do you have to back up your accusation ???
If you wanted to point out the difference in our opinions, then use some decent, useful and facts to back it up - that would make your statements make sense and make it more understandable.
But in this case it, to me appears - your opinion is, to be perfectly honest, bordering childish.
If you want to take this any further I suggest you PM me instead.
Let the people read factual things in this thread instead of the ramblings of two guys arguing and getting personal (Usually the way this turns out isn't it) in the open forum.
Last edited by KV.; April 21st, 2010 at 15:56..
|April 21st, 2010||#16|
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Sorry for the off topic, just explaining some other off topic thing in this topic...
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.
Sir Winston Churchill
|April 21st, 2010||#17|
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(where did he mention babies killing?), quote Rattler
In the second paragraph: "only civilians (including children and a pregnant mother)."
May be you believe different, but the last time I checked pregnant women are considered to be carrying babies.
You are the one trolling as you add nothing to the topic, just a personal attack toward me.
I am entitled to express my opinion the same as Reaper.
Why do I believe he just wants to flame the military? Because he states it:
"So why the hell did the United States invade Afghanistan in the first place and why did Brittain, Australia, Canada and several European NATO countries even follow?"
"this is my perspective of the subject." quote Reaper
As far as Ted's post goes, there was a similar topic that was locked. So we have Reaper starting another one? Coincidence?
To me these threads are tired old reruns. I think Ted and Rattler agree, as they never bothered to address the topic in their post.
|April 21st, 2010||#18|
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China isn't overly oppressive. It's not an ideal government but it is by no means a government of pure evil. North Korea however, is most definitely in the deep end of the moral pool and needs to step down and let Korea be one again.
Of course, all the mines, Automated turrets, and other traps in the NK and SK border may make the initial korean reunion very messy.
|April 21st, 2010||#19|
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well. . . info
it might have something to do with massive amounts of oil "recently discovered" in the area, if nothing else.
i did notice that soon after similar "recent discoveries" were made in Africa, after years of neglect the government decided to launch AFRICOM.
and, with the arctic ice cap melting and discoveries of oil there, Russia, the US and other countries made their rush to claim a stake in it.
of course, i will be the first to admit that i am going by memory. i can't give quotes; at least, not now.
but that is how i remember it.
|April 21st, 2010||#20|
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Tibet, anyone? (just to menton somethn in case it was a serious question, the list could go on, and on, and on)
15M(ay): Noooobody! ...expects the Spanish Revolution!:
Update SEP 2011: Now reached US, called "Occupy Wall Street" and they claim they invented it. Thanks for learning from Spain!
Last edited by rattler; April 21st, 2010 at 20:50..
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