Topic: Over the Top Training?

the_13th_redneck · November 23rd, 2004

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...eut/index.html

Well you know Germans like that sort of stuff

Chocobo_Blitzer · November 23rd, 2004

I didn't know militaries made a habit of training for torture.

MadeInChina · November 23rd, 2004

um... thats not as bad as in the russian military, where the second year recruits often torture the fresh recruits and use them as their tools

u can google the web for an article abou tthat in which i saw somwehre on a military forum, just cant find the time to locate it

Ed · November 23rd, 2004

Looks to me more like bastardization than a proper training plan.

Redneck · November 23rd, 2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRUNKER

um... thats not as bad as in the russian military, where the second year recruits often torture the fresh recruits and use them as their tools

u can google the web for an article abou tthat in which i saw somwehre on a military forum, just cant find the time to locate it

If it's not worth your time to provide a source for this, it's not worthwhile to post it here either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_13th_redneck

Well you know Germans like that sort of stuff

13th, be careful what you post here, things like this can be very sensitive subjects and are not the best places for jokes, however harmless you may think they are, they can easily be offensive to others.

LIPS · November 23rd, 2004

Lets be carefull here as they are only allegations at this point. No one has been convicted as yet.

The reason I say this is many years ago I was in a unit that was under investigation for abuse it was in all the papers and in the end no body was found to be in the wrong. So before we jump to conclusions let justice run its course. If it is proven, than they will be dealt with by their proper legal system.

catalinargonzalez · December 1st, 2004

Breakdown and dysfunction of rule and order happens in every country at every level, it's human nature to have the potential to abuse power and make mistakes. I put this right up there with the beating and eventual killing of a homosexual US Army soldier a few years back, and let's not forget Abu Ghraib and what happened with Graner and England prior to the Abu Grahib scandal, so before we make judgements based on race, nationality, let's not forget that we have things like that happen on the homefront as well and they are isolated events for which we unfortunately get judged even though we may have nothing to do with them.

03USMC · December 1st, 2004

There are a few "facts" that seem to be missing. But it being CNN I'm not surprised.

1. What Type of Unit was this?

2. What kind of excercise / training was being conducted?

3. Were these Soliders trainees or assigned to a regular military unit?

If they were recruits or trainees then I have a problem with it. And would blame it on overzealous NCO's and a command breakdown.

If this was a Regular unit of Soliders in combat arms then to me it rings of SERE/ POW training. I have no problem with the military being trained to deal with that.

beardo · December 1st, 2004

those crazy germans

Iraq n Baq · December 1st, 2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by 03USMC

There are a few "facts" that seem to be missing. But it being CNN I'm not surprised.

1. What Type of Unit was this?

2. What kind of excercise / training was being conducted?

3. Were these Soliders trainees or assigned to a regular military unit?

If they were recruits or trainees then I have a problem with it. And would blame it on overzealous NCO's and a command breakdown.

If this was a Regular unit of Soliders in combat arms then to me it rings of SERE/ POW training. I have no problem with the military being trained to deal with that.

I agree - this sounds like some sort of SERE/POW survival training. If you can't subject soldiers to conditions similar to those encountered in combat to teach them how to survive and persevere in that environment - what's the point of going into battle anyway? Such training would be on the same level as a college student studying prior to an exam - soldiers need to 'study' themselves and the conditions in which they may someday find themselves in order to perform at their peak, and survive.

The bottom line is this is plain ludicrousy. What's next? An injunction on sending recruits through the CS gas chamber? Lawsuits over blisters and chaffing brought on by an extended tactical road march? Pvt Cowboy v GSgt Hartman for emotional pain and distress over the "golfball through a gardenhose" (etc) comments?

On the other hand, if these were truly fresh recruits, such training seems harsh and extreme by American standards, but it may be commonplace in foreign armed forces - I'm not familiar enough with foreign forces to comment on them.

November 23rd, 2004	Post 1
the_13th_redneck Fridgeraider (Instructor) Gear	Post; Over the Top Training? http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...eut/index.html Well you know Germans like that sort of stuff __________________ Sergeant 13th Redneck (RET) Republic of Korea Marine Corps TRESPASSERS WILL BE PROSTITUTED Next time you travel http://www.epictrip.com

November 23rd, 2004	Post 2
Chocobo_Blitzer Primus Pilus	I didn't know militaries made a habit of training for torture. __________________ \"The superior man, when resting in safety, does not forget that danger may come. When in a state of security he does not forget the possibility of ruin. When all is orderly, he does not forget that disorder may come. Thus his person is not endangered, and his States and all their clans are preserved.\"

November 23rd, 2004	Post 3
MadeInChina Primus Pilus	um... thats not as bad as in the russian military, where the second year recruits often torture the fresh recruits and use them as their tools u can google the web for an article abou tthat in which i saw somwehre on a military forum, just cant find the time to locate it __________________ A signature is a little text that can be added at the bottom of the posts you make. It\'s limited to 300 characters (size 7 to 12) on 5 line(s) and 1 image(s) with none larger than 100x500 pixels and for a maximum of 20Kb. In your text, no more than 100 characters without space too.

November 23rd, 2004	Post 4
Ed Optio	Looks to me more like bastardization than a proper training plan. __________________ \"There is no greater evil than the indifference of good men.\"

November 23rd, 2004	Post 6
LIPS Tribuni Angusticlavii	Lets be carefull here as they are only allegations at this point. No one has been convicted as yet. The reason I say this is many years ago I was in a unit that was under investigation for abuse it was in all the papers and in the end no body was found to be in the wrong. So before we jump to conclusions let justice run its course. If it is proven, than they will be dealt with by their proper legal system. __________________ Some more words of wisdom from LIPS

December 1st, 2004	Post 7
catalinargonzalez Banned	Breakdown and dysfunction of rule and order happens in every country at every level, it's human nature to have the potential to abuse power and make mistakes. I put this right up there with the beating and eventual killing of a homosexual US Army soldier a few years back, and let's not forget Abu Ghraib and what happened with Graner and England prior to the Abu Grahib scandal, so before we make judgements based on race, nationality, let's not forget that we have things like that happen on the homefront as well and they are isolated events for which we unfortunately get judged even though we may have nothing to do with them.

December 1st, 2004	Post 8
03USMC Milforum Moderator Gear	There are a few "facts" that seem to be missing. But it being CNN I'm not surprised. 1. What Type of Unit was this? 2. What kind of excercise / training was being conducted? 3. Were these Soliders trainees or assigned to a regular military unit? If they were recruits or trainees then I have a problem with it. And would blame it on overzealous NCO's and a command breakdown. If this was a Regular unit of Soliders in combat arms then to me it rings of SERE/ POW training. I have no problem with the military being trained to deal with that. __________________ The only people I like besides my wife and children are MARINES. Col. Oliver North USMC

December 1st, 2004	Post 9
beardo Centurion	those crazy germans

Topic: Over the Top Training?

Post; Over the Top Training?