If Westerners go to hostile (often Islamic) places chances are we'd be killed / kidnapped / ransomed / beheaded anyway as has happened loooooong before the Israeli passport scandal. The threats you have described Monty existed before and will exist whatever dodgy things Israel does. Give me a better argument and I might see things your way, but in the meantime get over it. I'm not asking you to support Israel, just accept that all nations spy on one another including friends and in a sense push the envelope a bit even with their friends. You point out a valid concern about the consequences but I would argue the threat pre-exists israel's dodgy use of foreign passports for its operatives and they are not alone in this practice - today and throughout history. i repeat....get over it.

Yes well my suggestion is simple, they can steal passports and we will simply stop assisting them and deal with those that are less disposed to them.

After all if you cant tell your friends from your enemies then there is no reason to keep them as friends.

Now how many Aussies was it you were sacrificing to keep Israel as a friend, 10, 100, 1000?

For the record I doubt any one will be "getting over it" any time soon because we are getting sick of catching them at it, once you can can over look, twice you start getting wary but after that you start losing your sense of humour.

You tell me?

How many Aussies have been executed or kidnapped as a result of Israeli operatives using AUS passports. Stats please? Evidence please? names & dates please?

The Israeli passport scandal involving AUS passports happened when? You guessed right Monty, well over 12 months ago - plenty of time to observe the consequences. So what have the consequences been directly to Australia? Sacrifices in life so far = 0 ...... unless you have names and dates and causes of death to report.

Why would I tell you, I am asking you at which point you will draw the line I am not telling you anything.

But hey if you are good with it we may have just solved the problem all these dodgy countries can just use Aussie passports I am sure New Zealand wont mind and as long as you don't care about the consequences everything is good.

Maybe you could just forward your info directly to the Israeli embassy along with any details of deceased relatives you may have to help them out after all that is what friends do right?
Hell by the end of the year there could be hundreds of Mr Padre's (and relatives) assassinating people and stealing information around the world.

Oh and while we are at it...

http://www.watoday.com.au/national/i...0524-w5a3.html

"Mr Smith said that the Australian investigation cleared the four Australians whose identities were used in the operation. They were “innocent victims”, he said."

Wonder if those guys plan to travel any time soon also be interesting to see if they share your opinion as well.

Originally Posted by MontyB

After all if you cant tell your friends from your enemies then there is no reason to keep them as friends.

Should I ever invite a "friend" into my home, and I discover that he is deliberately kicking my dog when I'm not looking, I immediately realise that he was never my friend, and he never will be.

I'll leave it up to the christians to turn the other cheek. (And I'll report the b@stards to the RSPCA)

I was wondering how long it would take you to come into this Seno.

If your friend from another house in the street was in mortal danger from hostile forces and he dressed up as your wife to trick the enemy and kill them, using the disguise to get into the enemy's house, and later through the enemy's channel of comms let it be known it wasn't really your wife, or the police exposed the disguise, I don't think your "friend's" enemy would retaliate against you or your wife.

It's nasty unpleasant business but welcome to Earth 101 and Humanity 101 and International Spying 101 Counter Terrorism 101. The main point I am making is NZ, Australia, USA, UK, France - anyone, has or would do such things if they had to for survival or to counter a threat.

I'd rather they did not use their own allies passports, but I'm just not shocked and Israel is not alone in this modus operendi.

Originally Posted by Padre

I was wondering how long it would take you to come into this Seno.

If your friend from another house in the street was in mortal danger from hostile forces and he dressed up as your wife to trick the enemy and kill them, using the disguise to get into the enemy's house, and later through the enemy's channel of comms let it be known it wasn't really your wife, or the police exposed the disguise, I don't think your "friend's" enemy would retaliate against you or your wife.

It's nasty unpleasant business but welcome to Earth 101 and Humanity 101 and International Spying 101 Counter Terrorism 101. The main point I am making is NZ, Australia, USA, UK, France - anyone, has or would do such things if they had to for survival or to counter a threat.

I'd rather they did not use their own allies passports, but I'm just not shocked and Israel is not alone in this modus operendi.

Yeah,... well wonder no more. I guess someone here has to exhibit at least some small amount of morality.

Quite simply, my alleged "friend" would find that his "enemy" had suddenly become the least of his worries. I'm afraid that suffering the stupidity, treachery and duplicity of others, is certainly not one of my weaknesses.

If "we" do it, and are we are caught, I hope whoever catches the party responsible gives them something similar to that which I would give my alleged "friend". Naaahhh,... and it's not a box of chocolates, although he might well foul his rompers as a result.

Oh, and as far as I know we are certainly not Israel's "Ally", in fact I think our Intelligence people realise that we are not even their "friend" except perhaps on a very rarified diplomatic level.

A lot of countries are surrounded by enemies.
It's usually how the lines were drawn up in the first place.

We in Spain just had the Israeli ambassador relieved (normaly, finished his tour), and in his farewell interview he remarked that he had rarely lived in a country with so much "antisemitic" feelings expressed, espeically during the time of the Gaza attacks...

http://tundratabloids.com/2011/07/is...tic-spain.html

Israel’s ambassador in Madrid described the “hatred and anti-semitism” he had experienced during his four years in Spain, in a message post on the embassy website Saturday. Raphael Shutz said that his four years in Spain had included some difficult moments. He cited Israel’s January 2009 assault on the Palestinian-held Gaza Strip, which provoked an international outcry; and the May 2010 commando raid on a Gaza-bound aid convoy in which nine Turkish activists were killed. In addition, he said, “…the fact of having personally experienced the hate and the anti-semitism that exists in Spanish society is something that I take away with me.”

Mr., youre not doing your country a favor confusing "anti-israel" feelings with "anit-semitic" feelings, it simply is not the same.

I have yet run into someone (Spaniard) who expresses anti-semitic feelings, but I sure know a hell of a lot of people being directly opposed to the crimes your nation constantly commits under the auspice of some perceived "victimism". The problem is the *state* Israel and its organized state terrorism, not the Jewish religion. Your stance is the best example for what is wrong with you guys.

FWIW,

Rattler

The very term "Anti Semitic' is not so much meaningless, but is fast becoming an approbation. All because of the constant and deliberate misuse of this term by the supporters of Zionism, who cast it about like rice at a wedding, the instant anyone confronts them with the unpleasant truth.