Originally Posted by major liability

I'm not some crazy person who denies the holocaust. But the holocaust is not a good reason to give them a patch of land that someone else was living on. They weren't living in Israel at the beginning of World War II, were they?

I sense that you may want to learn some thing about this heated debate and I'd like to suggest that you take this book to read. Written by a die-hard-liberal jewish professor of Harvard Univ.

The Case for Israel by: Alan Dershowitz

It'll answer your questions about Israel and the jewish issues. I am sure your local library has it. Give it a try!

Or check this link

http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/facts%20about%20israel/history/

That's all well and good Del Boy, but why does America have to get involved with their mess? We have nothing to do with it.

Originally Posted by major liability

That's all well and good Del Boy, but why does America have to get involved with their mess? We have nothing to do with it.

Should the US and rest of the civilized world let the Israelis be slaughtered by their savage enemies?!?

You could ask that same question about many, many countries around the world, just look at what's happening in Myanmar now. Are we to stand by and let the Karen people get exterminated? Yes, yes we are. The US simply doesn't have any interests there. Why does Israel deserve special treatment?

I'm not against Israel really, I don't want to see them destroyed. I just think it was an overwhelmingly stupid decision to put them right in the middle of their worst enemies. We wouldn't have to worry about them being slaughtered by their savage enemies in the first place if they were in a different part of the world! I suppose it's mostly Britain's fault for giving them land that had already been promised to the Arabs, but still, you have to wonder what the hell they were smoking when they made that decision.

Edit: Would you rather live in your holy land, with a constant fear of mortar attack or suicide bomb, or live in Canada?

major - I think you will find that The League of Nations (pre UN) organised the re-establishment of the Jews homeland - which already existed, and was much larger than it is now. One half was given to the Arabs ,which is now Jordan. Jews from Arab countries then moved over. The British held the mandate from 1936 but used very strict limits for immigration of Jews. But of course , to the Arabs, nothing was ever enough. The infidel's foot in the middle east is unacceptable to the Arabs, although the Islamic footprint is spread throughout the west in very large numbers.

The question of USA involvement is not for me to comment on. All I can say is that the middle east was chosen mainly because it has always been the Jewish homeland. Where we toast Happy New Year, for many hundreds of years Jews would toast 'Next Year - in Jerusalem.'

Originally Posted by major liability

You could ask that same question about many, many countries around the world, just look at what's happening in Myanmar now. Are we to stand by and let the Karen people get exterminated? Yes, yes we are. The US simply doesn't have any interests there. Why does Israel deserve special treatment?

I'm not against Israel really, I don't want to see them destroyed. I just think it was an overwhelmingly stupid decision to put them right in the middle of their worst enemies. We wouldn't have to worry about them being slaughtered by their savage enemies in the first place if they were in a different part of the world! I suppose it's mostly Britain's fault for giving them land that had already been promised to the Arabs, but still, you have to wonder what the hell they were smoking when they made that decision.

Edit: Would you rather live in your holy land, with a constant fear of mortar attack or suicide bomb, or live in Canada?

Those many nations you think of, are not surrounded by countries that WANT to wipe them off the map. Israel is. That's why we have a moral obligation to help them sustain themselves.

Originally Posted by phoenix80

Should the US and rest of the civilized world let the Israelis be slaughtered by their savage enemies?!?

They seem to manage quite well without our interference. I'm sure that they are big enough to protect themselves from any local aggressors.

Originally Posted by major liability

They got kicked out. Too bad for them. You don't see Native Americans getting a free pass to their ancestral lands.

So what are you saying you Support Iran because they followed what the US has done in the past. And that makes it ok then?

What if Israel killed of 6 million Americans in gas ovens and such, thats ok too because germany has done that in the past, and Israel was just following them.

And since one country has done it then its all ok?!?!?!

Just follow the example!

Let me quite honesty say here.... WTF!

That's all well and good Del Boy, but why does America have to get involved with their mess? We have nothing to do with it.

Major I am just hoping you have some grasp on whats happening in the real world mate. Of course the US has a stack in Israel. One basic reason defence agreements, two there are lot of Israelis with families in the US. Would you not wish you country to help your family.

Your anti-semite attitude is quite shocking.

Do you not believe in Allied agreements? Do you believe the US should only stay with its self and become a vaccum?

Or do you believe because the are not Americans the are worth nothing, and there for you should not help them?

Originally Posted by senojekips

They seem to manage quite well without our interference. I'm sure that they are big enough to protect themselves from any local aggressors.

^^^ while it is okay for you to let the Israelis at the mercy of their brutal enemies, responsible citizens of this world can't think like you do.

Originally Posted by senojekips

They seem to manage quite well without our interference. I'm sure that they are big enough to protect themselves from any local aggressors.

Just local aggressors. you have Hamas, Hez-ball-less, Iran, Iraq and Afganistan, the Arabs in their many forms all wanting a piece of you.

As normal they are way out numbered, a little help from the US was greatly welcomed and highly respected.

IDF are great fighters but even they can not always do it alone.