Iraq buys $112m in arms from Chinese

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Robin Wright and Ann Scott Tyson in Washington
October 5, 2007

IRAQ had ordered $US100 million ($112 million) worth of light military equipment from China for its police force, contending that the United States was unable to provide the material and was too slow to deliver arms shipments, the Iraqi President, Jalal Talabani, said.
The deal with China, not previously made public, has alarmed military analysts, who note that Iraq's security forces are already unable to account for more than 190,000 weapons supplied by the US. Many of these are believed to be in the hands of Shiite and Sunni militias, insurgents and other forces seeking to destabilise Iraq and target US troops.
"The problem is that the Iraqi Government doesn't have - as yet - a clear plan for making sure that weapons are distributed, that they are properly monitored and repeatedly checked," said Rachel Stohl, of the independent Centre for Defence Information, based in Washington.
News of the Iraqi arms deal came as Lieutenant-General Raymond Odierno, the top US commander for day-to-day operations in Iraq, said he expected a US presence would be required for "at least three to five more years" and would involve 25,000 to 50,000 troops, depending on security conditions.
Detailed planning was under way for the US military to begin scaling back its primary mission from one of fighting a counter-insurgency to an advisory and training role, which would involve pulling troops out of Iraqi cities and closing some American bases, he said.
The Chinese arms deal sheds light on the larger dispute between the United States and Iraq over rebuilding the country's armed forces and police. Iraqi officials have long complained about the supply of weapons and equipment for their personnel.
Iraq has become one of the largest buyers of US-made weapons. General David Petraeus told the Senate armed services committee last month that Baghdad had signed deals to buy $US1.6 billion in US arms, with another $US1.8 billion in possible weapons purchases.
■ Kuwait would not accept any plan to divide Iraq into federal regions and wanted the US to remain there until the country was stable, its ruler said yesterday. "We will not accept the partition of Iraq … It will be dangerous for the whole region," Sheik Sabah al-Ahmad al-Sabah told Al-Arabiya television.
The Washington Post, Reuters

So Iraq decided to go with Chi-Com weapons instead of American weapons.... The issue that I see is that China is selling arms to Iran and Iran is giving those weapons to the terrorists. So China decided to just skip it and supply weapons to both sides. Well..... it shows me that China is wanting to get into the game of making a name for it's self in the Middle East.

While I clearly understand your point but I'd like to say that the reason may be the tradition of the Iraqi armed forces being used to soviet style weapons.

Moreover, I think they are now a sovereign nation and can decide whats good for them. Although I, just like you, would be more happier if they had purchased US stuff and paid the Americans.

Personally I would be happy about it, the last thing you want is good western gear being on sold to the insurgency.

The United States should cut off all Funding for Iraq, and send them a bill for the United States Military being there all this time.

Originally Posted by Gator

...and send them a bill...

YES. There are many ways to repay us, like all that black goo under their land...

Amateurs use AK-47's, professionals use M-16's. The Iraqi police forces most definitely are not professionals and so they should not be using weapons that require an expert's attentiveness. Soviet equipment (and by association any non-western equipment since they all copied the Soviet Union) is inferior in quality and precision but it can fire after sitting in a barrel filled with salt water for three months. The Iraqi's abilities will be hampered by their own inabilities if the are given higher quality American arms. Plus it's like Phoenix said, they've been using this same equipment for some thirty years now, stick with what you know.

I had beers w/ a close friend who works for one of those three letter agencies actively involved in the proverbial sand box. I was taken back when he had mentioned the AK-47 being the standard weapon being used by Iraqi police (actually, a lot of them carry a modified folding stock version).
The AK-47 is a crude weapon, its meant to kill and nothing less (your not taking it to the range to test your marksmanship). Its cheap - try 5/1 when comparing costs of an Ak to a AR15.
The other concern is the loyalty of the the police force - do we really want to be handing over surperior firepower to a force that has had many issues w/ loyalty to date?
I would not be surprised to find at a later date more sophisticated units carrying modified m-4's and variants there of - but for now, I think as does my associate, its a matter of cost and loyalty.

Hey now, AK-47s may be old but they'll still go through walls that a 5.56 rifle just can't. They're not as accurate at all, but still accurate enough to kill at 300 yards. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't most of the action in Iraq in cities?

Don't get me wrong; I'd take an AR-15 any day of the week, but I think Kalashnikovs are actually superior weapons for Iraqis. Less maintenance, ridiculous durability, cheaper than dirt...

I kind of agree with MontyB on this one. Better they use inferior weapons against us than our own American-made rifles.

An AR-15? Not me. It's an M-16 unless I didn't have much money and then an AK I suppose is better than nothing.
Yep, I think the only reason anyone carries an AK in combat is for lack of funds. If I want to perforate a wall, there are lots of better tools for that job.
It doesn't surprise me that Iraq is opting for the cheaper weapons. It's in line with a lot of what seems to be going on there these days.