Election 2008: War in Iraq

The US will go eventually, probably with its tail between its legs.


It won't be the military with it's tail between it's legs. If anyone goes out like that it will be the politicians who buggered it up in the first place.
 
That's exactly what he was saying, at least according to my interpretation.
A lot of people think Vietnam was a military failure. They're morons, but they're uninformed and they go with what they've heard from similarly uninformed persons. I believe that ending the war in Vietnam was the highlight of the Nixon Administration.

But the topic at hand is the current war. And I like the idea of the end of the war being during the next administration as compared to one four elections down the road.
 
Here's the deal. We have to go at some point. As long as we are on the ground Iraq is a magnet for every two bit former goat herder Jihadist with a freakin RPG.

The question now should be when do the Iraqi's take over.
 
True enough......the only thing that's ever really bothered me about this war is that I feel it should have been Iran, at least before Iraq if Iraq was still a target. I feel/felt like the case against Iran has been way stronger, since 79.
 
Here's the deal. We have to go at some point. As long as we are on the ground Iraq is a magnet for every two bit former goat herder Jihadist with a freakin RPG.

The question now should be when do the Iraqi's take over.

I'm amazed, somebody actually agrees with me. I have been saying exactly this for the past 3 years.

This is what most Americans don't understand. No matter how noble the cause is (or they think it is) people in other countries don't take kindly to uninvited armies on their Lilly pad, or US bombs that crash through their houses. It really pisses them off. People will always defend their turf NO MATTER what the reason whether its to elimination infidels, heathens, Facists, Communists, Criminals, Warlords, or Terrorists.

Alot of the "Terrorists" in Iraq are not Islamic Extremists. Many of which are Iraqi or Arab nationalists that are fighting to remove an invader. The real jihadists of course feed on this nationalist sentiment to fuel their own causes.
 
Too bad they didn't try so hard when it came to Saddam and other secular dictators who were oppressing many groups in those countries pretty badly.
I think it goes to show just how soft we are. No body f*cks with you if the very next day the authorities will round up your relatives and have them shot. But that's just now how we do things.
 
Alot of the "Terrorists" in Iraq are not Islamic Extremists. Many of which are Iraqi or Arab nationalists that are fighting to remove an invader. The real jihadists of course feed on this nationalist sentiment to fuel their own causes.


This part a tend to disagree with a bit. Most of the non-Iraqi's are connected to the Islamic Fundamentalist movement and answering a Fatwa, making them Jihadists fighting a Jihad declared by some Mullah in Syria, Iran, Saudi or where ever. They are rat lined in by Jihadists and supplied and supported by same.

Some of the Iraqi's are nationalist's others are the same old Baathists that were running the show and just another version of what was called Fedayeen
 
No doubt there's also a gang element looking to capitalize on the chaos and secure their own little territories where they can run their own protection rackets etc.
Often these can take on the guise of being nationalists or independence fighters.
 
Too bad they didn't try so hard when it came to Saddam and other secular dictators who were oppressing many groups in those countries pretty badly.
I think it goes to show just how soft we are. No body f*cks with you if the very next day the authorities will round up your relatives and have them shot. But that's just now how we do things.
They didn't have the freedom before to remove an oppressor. Now they do, and they're trying.
 
My point exactly TOG.
Though the US isn't exactly an oppressor (compared with some other countries who have done occupation work), it is an element that's getting in the way of many groups' plans.
Actually if the US was a true oppressor, half of these insurgents would be out of business before sundown.
 
My point exactly TOG.
Though the US isn't exactly an oppressor (compared with some other countries who have done occupation work), it is an element that's getting in the way of many groups' plans.
Actually if the US was a true oppressor, half of these insurgents would be out of business before sundown.
We can't be nice to everyone and expect to win. Either fight to win, which would mean doing some dirty work, or get out.
 
Hear hear. And what Bush is trying to do is both be nice, and win.... It doesn't happen in war.... If it did, it'd be a nicer world....
 
You're right TOG. When you fight you gotta fight.
The bad news is, this is the way the public demands the military behaves when it engages itself overseas which means our guys will never be able to fight a winnable war ever because they have to answer to millions of people who don't understand and will never understand that the world isn't like a nice drive to the mall. Food doesn't magically appear at the shelves at Safeway.
You know what struck me in my current US trip?
It never really struck me years ago when I was here but now I'm seeing things differently. You know all those cars... those BIG ass cars that people drag everywhere to get their XXXL stuff at Safeway, COSTCO etc... and it struck me. These are probably the same folks who go protest "NO WAR FOR OIL" and maybe even occasionally sing "Give peace a chance."
You know what the military's doing overseas? It's maintaining our way of life. Whether it's protecting our territorial integrity or securing our lines of communication and supply and access to resources we need. Maintaining our way of life.
Yet when it sets out to do these things people who can't look beyond their own peaceful patch of Earth have their own "opinions" about how it should be done.
Sorry if my writing is weird right now but the music is playing in the background it and it tends to throw me off.
 
It never really struck me years ago when I was here but now I'm seeing things differently. You know all those cars... those BIG ass cars that people drag everywhere to get their XXXL stuff at Safeway, COSTCO etc... and it struck me. These are probably the same folks who go protest "NO WAR FOR OIL" and maybe even occasionally sing "Give peace a chance."


Which reminds me of a sign we had in our Company CP in the Sand Box.

America is at War!

Naw really the Military is at War.

America is at the Mall.
 
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