Of course this behaviour is disgusting. Like what we have here in Spain every weekend:

A group of young drunks destroyed the Arab war cemetery from 1487 last year more or less in the same stupid way (they drove around in it with a truck).

A group of drunk youngsters destroyed the Jewish cemetery this year in January in Palma, braking the tombs and painting everything with SS runes.

Some more drunk youngsters destroyed the garbage containers near my house setting them on fire, just two days ago, got caught all 8 of them 2 were 13, the rest between 15 and 17...

As you can see, those in the vid young hooligans who are way beyond their limits to understand what they are doing and why, but the same happens every weekend in Europe (and I guess in the States also).

Originally Posted by captiva303

-snip- Arab peoples and nations need to learn to become mature world citizens. They need to grow up!!! - snip-

What do you think they are doing right now? Just what you ask them to... How long did it the Christian nations take to become mature world citizens and to grow up? 500 years? (Oh, no, got that wrong, it were 600...!). And not even this is clear when we see Northern Irish Catholics throwing hand grenades at protestant children on their way to school or vice versa...:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-13343685

Seriously, are you expecting stuff to change within a year or so when we are talking generations? Dont forget the Christian culture was way behind the Arab one just a few 800 yrs ago, burning people on the stack in the thousands for "sex with the devil", claiming it to be a capital sin to open a human body to find out what was in there, etc., the Catholic Church only 22 years ago allowed women here in Spain to have a bank account that they could move mone off without written permit of their husbands...

Are you kidding me with your statement? Or can you not see that it is ridiculous? Given todays acceleration lets talk in 80 yrs again about progress in Arab nations (and be happy you wont have to wait 800...) and lets see whether in Ireland things have changed a bit by then.

Dont make a fool of yourself by viewing the world just from your point in time or from *your* cultural POV, please (or say why in a particular case this should be done so, just for the record).

Rattler

It is 2012, not 1312. There are no excuses for this **** behavior. I am with captiva here, this personally affects me and my country. I feel you are saying what they have done is acceptable, because it is the same as kids burning bins in your country? What a joke!

Yeah because those people who gave their lives then had everything to do with the Koran burning.

Originally Posted by rattler

Seriously, are you expecting stuff to change within a year or so when we are talking generations? Dont forget the Christian culture was way behind the Arab one just a few 800 yrs ago, burning people on the stack in the thousands for "sex with the devil", claiming it to be a capital sin to open a human body to find out what was in there, etc., the Catholic Church only 22 years ago allowed women here in Spain to have a bank account that they could move mone off without written permit of their husbands...

Are you kidding me with your statement? Or can you not see that it is ridiculous? Given todays acceleration lets talk in 80 yrs again about progress in Arab nations (and be happy you wont have to wait 800...) and lets see whether in Ireland things have changed a bit by then.

Dont make a fool of yourself by viewing the world just from your point in time or from *your* cultural POV, please (or say why in a particular case this should be done so, just for the record).

Rattler

I was angry at the time of writing this so it is not as well put and diplomatic as it could have been. So it may give the wrong messages, But that still doesn't change that Arab countries need to grow up. Social change has become alot quicker than it used to take.

Its not ridiculous it is what needs to happen. I didn't specify a time frame but I am sure it can be achieved, a lot quicker than 800 years or even 80 years. What happened is wrong and needs to be addressed.


It is different to stupid fringe groups that you mention because these people you mention are already seeded with hate are completely stupid and are acting out there stupid beliefs. Whereas these Libyans are reacting to global events which are of extremely little consequence. So they need to be more responsible global citizens and not take offense or at the vary least not go about destroying things(that applies to everyone who is that way inclined not just these silly Libyans).

So dont make a fool of yourself by reading way to much into what I said. You drew conclusions far beyond the scope of anything I said. So calling me a fool is quite foolish. React to what I said, DO NOT start beasting me because you think I have different POV.


The Argument that their cultures need time to grow up. Is stupid anyway everyone else has managed to so why shouldn't they be expected to aswell?

Originally Posted by captiva303

The Argument that their cultures need time to grow up. Is stupid anyway everyone else has managed to so why shouldn't they be expected to aswell?

It is far from stupid, the West centuries ago threw off religion as its controlling influence and the result is that we became far more tolerant (ironic isn't it) because religion can not tolerate difference, parts of the Muslim world have done the same and they have also progressed.

Basically if you want to end this sort of thing you have to free the people not of mortal despots and dictators but of spiritual ones, it will happen with time and believe it or not people doing this sort of thing is one of the signs of change.

Even more fuel for my fire
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/hundre...-1226288488854

**** religion all of it ****. Tolerance for lies, people dying in the name of invisible spooky father figures. There is no evidence of god anywhere except for some old ass hate filled books. Atheist till the day I die **** heaven **** hell **** the bible **** the quran.

Originally Posted by trailbrake2088

**** religion all of it ****. Tolerance for lies, people dying in the name of invisible spooky father figures. There is no evidence of god anywhere except for some old ass hate filled books. Atheist till the day I die **** heaven **** hell **** the bible **** the quran.

Thats fine, I will still hold the door and pull out a chair for you given the opprotunity.

But I gotta have faith in something.

And I will always have faith in human dignity, whether everybody on this rock has it , or in the case of these youngsters not.

What happend their is a disgrace. This was not vandalism, this was the destruction of non-muslim graves on muslim ground, but we must also say that the Lybian government condemned the action. This was an action of Islamic fanatics. They don't care if those people gave their lives for the liberation of their country.

@rattler : can you give me some more information of the destruction of the Arab war grave in Spain, because I can't find it. I also couldn't find the destruction of the Jewish graves in Palma.
According to your information the first and third destruction is vandalism, the second is anti-semitism.

We do not know what the outcome will be of the Arab Spring. What we do know is that it was started by secular young people and later hijacked by islamic groups.

Belgium was very peacefull until it became part of the Spanish Empire. The Spanish armies fought against the Dutch Protestants and the Spanish Inquisition was terrible. They also destroyed Jewish and Islamic culture in Spain.

Most Christian countries were established because they changed religion, most Muslim countries were established by force, conquered by Islamic armies.

Islamic nations had plenty of time to become "mature world citizens" but they didn't want to because their rule of law (if you can call it that) is written about 1400 years ago! They have acces to internet, mobile phones, planes and cars, and all the luxury we have too. Nowadays countries can change in months, not centuries. Our nations had to found out the hard way, they just have to copy it - but they don't.

Also, what happened in Ireland stays in Ireland, but the Muslim fanatics are attacking each other and others all over the world.

Originally Posted by VDKMS

-snip-
@rattler : can you give me some more information of the destruction of the Arab war grave in Spain, because I can't find it. I also couldn't find the destruction of the Jewish graves in Palma.

I had read in one of the newspapers that I go trhough in the morning, IIRC the Arab case in El Mundo. Could not find it in their archive, though.

Respect of the Jewish cemetry I had read it in Ultima Hora, but doublechecking I think I confused that and it was in San Luis (Argentina), though that should not make any difference with regard to the effect.

http://www.linkinformativo.com.ar/content/view/4478/38/

Rattler