Hey come on people. Let's not argue about what seems to be a misunderstanding.
Maybe that's another point... sometimes people take things too personally.

I simply do not like ladies being shouted at for no reason.

Thats it, dont have to be a mod for that, its called education (or lack of).

Rattler

I'll let this thread stay open since there are some good suggestions in here, but I strongly suggest that you stay away from personal attacks in here from now on!

Topic reminder: Discussions about improving the forum

Off-topic posts from now on will lead to infractions, that's a promise...

Originally Posted by the_13th_redneck

Right so in other words, the civilian - military relationship on this board should be defined.

This is a general comment, not directed specifically to you Redneck

I keep hearing this remark about how civilians come here to deliberately insult soldiers as a problem here. I simply dont see this. While I grant you there are people in the world that are disrespectful of military servicepeople, but I have yet to met one here on this forum aside from the occasional 13 year old whom are short lived here anyway.

Civilians, (espicially those who stay for a spell) come here because they are interested by the military, by that very definition there is an admiration by us civvies for those who have served. I have a hard time accepting the notion that there are people who come here to deliberetly insult soldiers, espicially those of us civvies who have been here awhile. This forum is not what I call hippy friendly last time I checked. We do have a trolling problem in general as of late, but that applies to both civvies, and servicepeople.

On the rare moments I have seen something a "military bashing" accusation, its almost entirely because of a failure to read or understand the persons post. I suspect the issue of it being a "deliberate" attempt is perhaps more imagined then anything else, at least as far as Milforum goes.

If some says something that is interpreted to be insulting to soldiers 9/10 it isnt meant to be, so think, before jumping down someones throat. You can of course disagree, but dont expect someone to change their mind or apologize simply because it is insulting to you. Nor is something you find insulting, automatically wrong either. The absolute worse thing you can do is to get on a podium and start to preach, because I guerentee you that not only will it not work, but you willl make the situation even worse. NOBODY, (civilian or military) likes to be patronized.

Maybe its just me, and that I dont get it. Other than that, I agree with the rest of the suggestions made.

No I don't think it's just you and it is a good suggestion.

Elaborating between the civilian-military relationship here...
- Servicemembers should give civilians the benefit of the doubt.
a. At least in the beginning.
b. If there are suspicions of disrespect, it should be discussed with other members, military and civilian and the members should give reasons why it is either a case of disrespect or a case of misunderstanding. Then this can be taken to a moderator.
c. Let's try not to blow up over a post. I can't send my fist through my cable modem so it's kind of pointless. I'm guilty party here too but we have to fix this.

I know before I joined the service I had some pretty stupid thoughts too and had a run in with some military folks on a different forum. During the service and afterwards I realize that I was wrong and they were right. I didn't mean to be a troll or to be disrespectful but I just didn't know and I should have accepted their answer for what it was. A lot of us service members and ex- service members will know that before their head got shaved we were all clueless.

Actually brings me to another idea but I'll post it after I've given it more thought.

Re: Civvies-Mil relations

look folks:

I 2nd mmarsh´s last here fully: I have (in the short time that I am a member of this distinguished forum) not come across some deliberate "Mil bashing" attitude yet (but maybe some feel much more easily offended than myself?).

Civvies are the people that pay (paid) us, that make (in theory through elections) the political decisions we base(d) service upon, and in the end are our "clients". Military is all about civilians. We are (were) "service" people, and if we say "Country" we are talking about the essence, about the - sometimes ugly - mix of people that make it. Like it or not, thats the way it is (its not all about *your* family).

Ban the one or other idiot, accept the well educated controversial opinion, try to convince and open doors, behave, show them the responsibility the excert with their vote when sending you (or withdrawing you) from harms way, and, most of all, understand it might be *you* who is wrong...

Being military does not (yet) automatically mean you got more understanding of life, the universe and all than your peers...:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS7O3mmPv_w

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdyN2_GJmP8

But being mil and understanding that this unique ethos and bond brings a responsibility also (even if outdated: for the US FM 6-22, Germany DV 100, anyone?) will make you shine in front of the civvies (and - maybe? - make you more happy shaving this guy in the mirror every day).

My take, anyway.

Rattler

P.S.: I always liked our German "Citizen in Uniform" concept.

Originally Posted by Redleg

I'll let this thread stay open since there are some good suggestions in here, but I strongly suggest that you stay away from personal attacks in here from now on!

Topic reminder: Discussions about improving the forum

Off-topic posts from now on will lead to infractions, that's a promise...

I guess I'm taking a chance .. but ..

The ONLY "personal" attack wasn't mine Redleg ... all I did was to respond to a personal attack in what was definitely NOT a personal manner. My response was rather low key ... all I did was to ask when the person became a mod - I missed the announcement ... and .. commented that my posts were NOT illegal IAW the rules - we have had that discussion many times.

When did that become an infraction?????

This is what I have been talking about ... when a discussion just begins to warm up ... there will be a mod that jumps all over the thread/members.

"Off-topic posts from now on will lead to infractions, that's a promise..."

This is one of the reasons why I said the forum was NOT as good as it was back in 2005 when I signed on to the forum. Back then, the mods allowed the members to try to work out their differences before they were threatened with the mod's boots.

I guess the reason for this, is the rules have been tightened up since then. For what reason ... I DON'T KNOW.

Personally, I believe the mods "should" allow members the chance to work out their differences prior to using their mod boots in the public forum. A pm to each person from the mod, is normally adequate to resolve most arguments ... it shouldn't be necessary to use the public forum to post a warning every time. That should be reserved for those times when backdoor pms fail.

I second what Chief said.
What's a match where the referee is too quick to take out cards and send people off? Not much of a match at all.

This is what I have been talking about ... when a discussion just begins to warm up ... there will be a mod that jumps all over the thread/members.

"Warming up" is one thing, but going completely off-topic is never good!
No matter what, in my opinion..

This is one of the reasons why I said the forum was NOT as good as it was back in 2005 when I signed on to the forum. Back then, the mods allowed the members to try to work out their differences before they were threatened with the mod's boots.

4 years ago the forum was one fifth the size it is today, and much much easier to moderate.

I guess the reason for this, is the rules have been tightened up since then. For what reason ... I DON'T KNOW.

Actually the main reason is because of feedback received from you (the members) over the years.....

When we didn't moderate the threads (too much) we got a lot of complaints, and now when we actually do it we get complaints...

Originally Posted by Redleg

When we didn't moderate the threads (too much) we got a lot of complaints, and now when we actually do it we get complaints...

Actually we're asking that moderators should follow and join more threads and take an active role in them and reduce the overall amount of infractions (that occur with very little warning) and also the premature closing of threads.

Moderating the threads and increasing the number of infractions aren't the same thing.

The forum may be 1/5th the size of what it was back then if you include the people who sign up, post "hello" and never turn up again.