AChinese

I think you are PARTLY right, I think oil was at least part of the reason we invaded Iraq, but I do not think it was the only one. Simply put, All business and politics is tied to oil in that part of the world. Its impossible to escape.

But now that I have admitted that, Tell me, what country that doesnt have its dirty tricks/dirty deeds department. (I think Ted and IG will remember this discussion a few months back ). If you want prrof, what about the Arms deals China has made to Islamic Fundimentalist Iran? Iran uses these Chinese weapons for terrorism, and to bully its neighboors. Don't try and tell me that wasnt for oil too...

Originally Posted by PJ24

I didn't bother to watch the entire video, I got a short ways through and thought it was fluff.

I will say though, if any detention center is "secret," you won't know about it.

Also, I challenge you to proof that the war in Iraq is about only about oil. Please provide hardline facts.

I personally believe you have an agenda and no real interest in what you're discussing, and I think it stems from the posts about China. As Bulldogg says, this seems a little tit-for-tat. You feel someone has smeared mud on your country, and you want to return the favor. Maybe that isn't the case, but that's how your topic and posts ring.

I have, until this point, refrained from posting in this thread because I agree with the sentiments expressed by PJ24 and Bulldogg. I also think that achinese is super sensitive to any subject about China or its government. Just my two cents worth.

Originally Posted by bulldogg

There is no point to this thread other than a childish tit for tat mentality. Being unable to form a logical argument she instead resorts to posting graphic sensationalist pictures from a source which is as biased as possible... something that could never be seen from China were it photos of Falun Gong victims of the Security Bureau of China.

War is hell and guess what... people get killed.

Now Achinese are you trying to imply that American and other coalition forces in Iraq have purposefully targetted innocent civilians?

The obvious bias to achinese's posts has to be read to be believed.

ac, if you are going to blame Americans for the deaths of countless civilians in Iraq ... how about at least getting your facts correct. The statistics and pictures were generated by forces NOT friendly to the US and are very suspect to say the least.

It is a proven fact that insurgent forces and terrorists have killed twice as many members of their own citizens than American forces during the two times the United States military faced Saddam's "elite" forces and after. The deaths to civilian forces continues to climb ... what part of civil disorder (between factions), and terrorism on the part of insurgents aimed at civilians don't you understand???

As bulldogg pointed out, "War is hell and guess what... people get killed".

So - get over it.

Originally Posted by achinese

im only blaim american who start it for its own selfish interest(oil)

these picture were just a tip of iceburger. not to mention the secretly held detention center.
I don't know what are those u.s. sponsored human right groups for in front of this biggest ever human right violation. while never forget to make big headline for their so called "evil other country" violation .

And China doesn't do things that has its own self-interest in mind... *cough* Iran nuclear weapons *cough* oil *cough*

Btw, China has no right preaching to the US about human rights. Some nations of the EU, ok maybe, but China would be last on that list to preach to the US.

big bone, you are right, it's just someone(bulldogg) push me too hard to get pushed back by smearing mud onto our people. i had no interest at all in these issue in the first place.

Originally Posted by achinese

big bone, you are right, it's just someone(bulldogg) push me too hard to get pushed back by smearing mud onto our people. i had no interest at all in these issue in the first place.

I am sorry you feel this way. You should NOT take anything too personally on this forum. MOST of our members CAN get a little forceful with their posts and sometimes it comes across like they are picking on you (or) your country.

The fact remains ... China DOES NOT have a very good track record as far as human rights and a whole host of issues is concerned. When you print a "fact" it is not mud smearing ... it is JUST offering up the facts to bolster your point of view (nothing more and nothing less).

Instead of getting into a snit against someone who creates these posts, muster your arguments and give your point of view on the issues using facts instead of angry rhetoric and "graphic sensationalist pictures from a source which is as biased as possible". I know you are capable of carrying out a logical argument on these issues ... try it, you MAY just enjoy it.

yea, china still has alot place to improve but you will never realize the amount of criticism i get from this board (there's too much sino-phobia lurk around here). it's true that in certain period, every country has to give up somefreedom for stability and growth. if you compare china now to usa in the period of pre civil liberty movement(not clear if it's this period). in that case, china now is really really very very "perfect".

I just read the other thread about sentiments and posting and I guess this is a good example. But the tone of voice is very different in the last posts compared to the first. The first posts will harvest a lot of criticism, the later post will start a dialogue.

Originally Posted by PJ24

Also, I challenge you to proof that the war in Iraq is about only about oil. Please provide hardline facts

I find quotin you more and more pleasurable PJ, I don't know why? But both you and I know that you'll probably never find a shred of this on paper. But not being able to prove it doesn't mean it isn't true! Is it not slightly interesting that about 3/4 of the world community does find it odd that it is mostly oil-rich countries where the US interests are reinforced with military measures....

80 years ago the very same could be said of the Dutch, its military and the sources of fuel for their economy.

Can I get an "amen"?

And Achinese I am so sorry that I forced you to begin a thread you aren't interested in. Next time you decide to abdicate responsibility for your actions pick something you are at least interested in.

Originally Posted by bulldogg

80 years ago the very same could be said of the Dutch, its military and the sources of fuel for their economy.

Can I get an "amen"?

Hahahahaha, what a low and obvious blow Bulldogg! At least I'll never deny that we killed hundreds of thousands of people all over the globe, uprooted tranquil villages and rural way of lives and destroyed civilisations in the name of progress. We cultivated slave trade, drug trafficking and piracy and..... ruled the world and it's seven seas! Rule Hollandia, may our reign be feared by our opponents. Nowadays we just talk endlessly on end, and resolve everything via agreements. Not as adventurous, but it seems to work.