Darn AZ, I knew it was bad in there but I did not know it was that crazy.

Originally Posted by senojekips

There's nothing quite like first hand knowledge.

Yet,... I still vacillate between rehabilitation, and Soviet style labour camps. To be honest, I think there is a place for both of them, but those undergoing rehabilitation should be able to see what it's like for those in hard labour, just to give them a friendly warning, so to speak.

Act like a human, you get treated like a human. Act like an animal, and you'll wish you were one,... at least they have the protection of the RSPCA.

I don't vacillate at all, the role of the justice system is not to rehabilitate criminals it is to judge and assign punishment where necessary, not to act as a sort of social worker for inmates.

I am not arguing that prisons are nice places nor am I arguing that they are effective in rehabilitation but I do not believe that is there role.

Add me to what Rabs and Aiki last said, AZ - that sounds real hard. i think I'll shut up for a while about our weak system.

Gentlemen, please...

I did not post what I did to quiet or quell anyone or their opinion. I do not need people to agree with me to appreciate their input, and if I have stifled your opinion with my personal experiences then I owe an apology.

Believe me, it was difficult to air such dirty laundry here. I've no doubt that many of you have a much lower opinion of me now, as us veterans are expected to have more discipline than to violate the law. I deliberated many hours before clicking submit.

And yet, if the best alcohol and addict counselors are alcoholics and users, so too are the best incarceration counselors those that have experience on both sides of the sliding doors. I am not permitted to counsel in the jails here in AZ because of my record, but I would if I could. I saw way, way, way too many people lose hope in those God-forsaken cement boxes.

Watching a man lose his hope, his faith, his family, his self-respect, his pride, and his very essence of being is a sobering experience, to say the least. And never more so than over one life-mistake.

I can't help those men now, but if I can shed a little light to help bring reality to their plight here on the outside, then that is better than doing nothing. I am not a "do nothing" person. The assumption is that, Oh, jail isn't that bad. They did the crime, they'll do the time.

Unfortunately, this naive perspective is also the prevalent one.

I'm not saying that anyone is innocent according to the law. I've heard a lot of "false arrest" stories, but in the end they have always turned out to be absolute crap - some stipulation they found on the Internet or their shady lawyer promised them as a loophole. In the end, when the truth comes out, they actually did the crime and just want out of it.

One thing I can state with absolute honesty is that when I stood up in court, I did act like a man and admitted my transgressions. When the judge asked for my plea, I plead guilty and apologized. In fact, when pulled over for my second DUI and asked how much I'd drank, the officer applauded my honesty when I truthfully answered that I didn't remember, but it was more than 15.

But that doesn't mean I agree with ALL the laws on the books, and that is where I choose to focus my energy. When a man can be arrested, charged, and successfully prosecuted for yelling at a wall in his own home with no victim, the system itself is flawed. Change needs to occur. If I publicly embarrass myself in the effort to facilitate an understanding in the futility of these ridiculous laws eating up our tax dollars and making men give up on life, then so be it. I'm not smart enough to argue it from a legislative stance, but if a couple of you stop and think that perhaps the hype you know is not the truth of the matter, then I've done what I can for those on the inside serving stupid sentences for corrupt conviction because of ridiculous laws of frivolity.

I'm sure many of you don't and won't believe me, but some of the nicest, most generous, kindest, gentlest people I've met were serving time. I met my share of dirtbags too, of course. But just because you are "in" doesn't by definition make you a dirtbag.

This is the attitude I get when applying for a job. They see my record, I get the whole, "Sorry, but we cannot hire you because of your past record." To hell with the fact that my fortitude changed my life and made me overcome. To hell with the the fact that my last prosecution was a BS law stipulation. To hell with all my volunteer work, my now clean record, raising 5 good kids, being a dedicated husband and veteran's advocate. To hell with 15 years in a career with a flawless record and proven leadership experience, my time spent honorably in the US Army Infantry, or my 4.0 in my business degree.

What it comes down to is the precluding assumptions that going to jail makes you scum to society.

That is what makes people career criminals. They aren't born that way. Aside from a mental deficiency that stifles the natural knowledge of right and wrong, socio influences make criminals. Keep getting told you aren't good enough, you'll begin to believe it.

In my own case, I served 8 years in the US Army Infantry with an honorable discharge and enough chest cabbage for outstanding service to make your head spin. I have 15 years as an Industrial Electrician, 4 of those as a foreman making $27/hr. I ran 40-man crews and bonused out more times than not. I've been married, I've raised 5 kids, one currently serving his country in the US Air Force (Richard, 21) and one with 3 years of Air Force ROTC planning on joining (Tonia, 17). I take care of my elderly mom, sacrificing any semblance of personal life for the honor of giving back. I have a proven track record of years volunteering to the VA, my church, and my community. I have a Bachelor's of Science in Project Management with a 4.0 GPA (no, I am not lying) from Kaplan University, one of the top 50 business schools in the country. I speak at meetings for addicts, alcoholics, the chronic depressed, Veteran's advocacy groups, and former prisoners trying to make a new life.

Know what job I could get? I work at Ace Hardware. And the ONLY reason I landed this... prestigious position is because the lady who hired me is the owner's daughter and knows me and how hard I've busted my butt to correct my past 10 years ago. Even then I had to beg.

Yeah, make a once-proud soldier and man beg. There ya go! That'll do wonders to ebb the tide.

And I am only one in TENS OF THOUSANDS of veterans in this city alone that tried and just couldn't make civilian life work. Between my injury and the VA getting me addicted to Percosets instead of fixing the actual injury, I made some mistakes.

But those mistakes will forever haunt me, as AZ has no expunging clause. We can have it set aside, but that's of little use.

Tens of thousands of us just in Phoenix alone, folks. We try and try and try. We want better, we strive for it, we sacrifice for it. But, once a bad person, always a bad person. None of you who hire any of me, so I'm probably wasting my time.

But I hope not.

In the end, I've revealed enough that I will most likely leave this forum, too. My current and future doesn't matter. Now I'll be known as a dirtbag here, too, regardless of my faith and my tenacity over the last many years. It is the penance of the past that we are meant to suffer for mistakes. Yes, we are ultimately responsible.

That's a damn shame, too, as I've met many, many good friends here. But, as we used to say in the Infantry, it is what it is.

I'm sorry for the long post. I hope you'll read it and maybe reconsider your position on what actually constitutes a "bad guy" and the reality of previous mistakes that we have little to no recourse for.

God bless, folks. Again, sorry for being a long-winded b@stard. This is a passionate subject for me.

Your story has to go to a higher level and thank that lady and God for letting you have a job at all. The way the system is, you're either supposed to be mugging people or sleeping under a bridge or both. You're making it one step at a time and it's more than I could have done.
If I was in your position, a lot of tourists would have been getting their brain cases bashed in.
I've been following you on this whole thing for a while now and I just don't know what to say or what to do. Just be glad that you have a friend who let you get a job at ACE hardware. Really, I want to go find that lady and give her a big hug.
Lay low now, no shouting, nothing crazy or normal for that matter. Watch the TV volume... the world is becoming more and more controlled.

I gotta agree with AZ, the police do a hell of a job but sometimes their actions are extremely questionable, even on minor things like traffic stops.

Here's a math question for you.

A small truck and a car drive down a small steep hill at about 4-5 meters apart.
Now according the local Petersburg NY sheriff (as he explained) it to us the truck is doing 65mph our car 72mph.

How is that story even possible without the car rear-ending the truck given the small amount of space? And let me tell you my father is an old fart, he wouldn't drive 75mph if his life depended on it.

The truck was a local, my dad was in the countryside with NYC plates, I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out what the sheriff was thinking, pity he was his little BS story didn't quite match basic algebra.

It was the only time my father ever contested a speeding ticket in court.

When was this? The older radars some times didn't zero out quickly enough when you were tracking a second car and simply seemed to add the difference to the original speed.

But eithier way it dosen't make sense.

Originally Posted by 03USMC

When was this? The older radars some times didn't zero out quickly enough when you were tracking a second car and simply seemed to add the difference to the original speed.

But eithier way it dosen't make sense.

About 15-20 years ago, I can accept the fact that his rader might have relayed wrong info, but even so he should have realized that what was being displayed was not mathamatically possible before he hit his lights and pulled us over.

Up until about 10 years ago about the only people who actually were certified to use radars were State Boys and larger Dept's with Traffic Divisions. Smaller Dept's generally handed out radar guns with minimal training. So guys didn't really understand nor were they fully aware of the capabilities or lack of.

A lot of cases were lost because of it. Thats why most Dept's now require that Officers become certified on the system before they use it.

Or the guy was a rock.