http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...-2005Mar3.html

Could this be a retaliation to:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4228107.stm

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english...ent_418605.htm

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,...507278,00.html

Human rights was a big reason why EU did not lift the ban in 2004. As the next expected date of lifting the ban approaches (5-8-2005), human rights will no doubt be a big question again when deciding whether to lift the ban or not. It seems that China and the US are both heating up for this issue. What are your thoughts regarding the lifting of the ban?

My opinion is, being a Taiwanese, that lifting the ban is a bad idea. But hey I'll admit that I am 120% biased.

China attacking other Nations over Human Rights Issues is akin to North Korea attacking other nations over fair and open elections.

To be perfectly honest I agree with the Chinese sentiment here, if the USA expects to be taken seriously when making these statements it should perhaps clean up its own backyard first.

I am not claiming for a second that China doesnt deserve criticism over its human rights record but I also tend to believe that in many cases the human rights issue is being used as a smoke screen to hide the fear that a modernised China would be as much a true superpower as the US if not a bigger one.

The reason why China drummed up that is because the US ignored the improvement of China. The US is trying to stop the embargo ban by using any means it can grab.

Seriously, no countries need missles, radars, and fighters to commit human rights. Homemade hand guns and assult rifles can do the job nicely.

Human rights issue is just a sugar coat to the matter-regional power and influence.

Well, China accusing another nation of Human Rights violations is also quite the double standard, reminds me of an episode of COPS. A druggie called the police, said that someone stole $400 dollars worth of cocaine from his house, he wanted the police to go arrest that guy, he also went on to mention that he kept an inventory of his drugs and that he could prove that this guy stole some from him. See, both parties are guilty here, so why try to accuse someone else of doing something when you are doing the exact same thing ten fold.

Originally Posted by Boobies

The reason why China drummed up that is because the US ignored the improvement of China. The US is trying to stop the embargo ban by using any means it can grab.

Seriously, no countries need missles, radars, and fighters to commit human rights. Homemade hand guns and assult rifles can do the job nicely.

Human rights issue is just a sugar coat to the matter-regional power and influence.

No, but they do need those missiles in order to threaten their neighbors.

so why try to accuse someone else of doing something when you are doing the exact same thing ten fold.

From what I read the Chinese were pointing out the hypocracy in the US judging China on human rights while commiting similar violations (albeit not on the same scale) themselves, they arent saying we do it because the US does.

Zyca, I don't understand what perspective you are siding to. Eitherwise, it'll be better if you support your claim with more in-depth feedback from the EU. Why should the EU not lift the Ban? For what strong reason?Explain.

In my opinion, the US statement is considerably weak. Lifting an arms Embargo does not necessarily means that weapons would be targetted at Taiwan, now of course that is too absurd to say. Already, thousands of mainland troops are capable to strike upon the island at any moment.

And Bush threatening the EU if the Arms Embargo is lifted? A threat? Have he lost his mind?

Originally Posted by Cabal

Zyca, I don't understand what perspective you are siding to. Eitherwise, it'll be better if you support your claim with more in-depth feedback from the EU. Why should the EU not lift the Ban? For what strong reason?Explain.

In my opinion, the US statement is considerably weak. Lifting an arms Embargo does not necessarily means that weapons would be targetted at Taiwan, now of course that is too absurd to say. Already, thousands of mainland troops are capable to strike upon the island at any moment.

Maybe you don't get the drift. But if the arms ban is lifted, China could posess key weapons that would aid them in a possible military action against Taiwan in a future date.
Military action against Taiwan.
And guess where Zyca is from?
How about if France were a real threat to Germany and the US decided to sell the French M-1A2s at bargain prices, along with F-117 stealth fighters? How would you react?
The problem with China is that they may not make it across the channel TO Taiwan. They could just sink in the Taiwan Straight. Why? Because China doesn't really have the capability to get those troops over there with that much dominance. So right now the balance is fragile. If the Americans send a fleet to Taiwan in response to China's movements, the Chinese have to think long and hard if it's worth having a bunch of their equipment and men in the bottom of the sea. Now imagine the Chinese don't need to fear the American fleet anymore.

Maybe you don't get the drift. But if the arms ban is lifted, China could posess key weapons that would aid them in a possible military action against Taiwan in a future date.

I think you may have overlooked the fact that they already have that ability, the thing keeping them out of Taiwan is not the military capacity of Taiwan (which would certainly pack a punch but is hardly likely to be able to handle the shear volume of the mainlands material) but more that they would be fighting the US and its arsenal as well.

I am somewhat convinced that the US desire to keep the embargo in place has more to do with the US trying to maintain some control over European affairs than it is in protection of Taiwan.

Originally Posted by the_13th_redneck

Maybe you don't get the drift. But if the arms ban is lifted, China could posess key weapons that would aid them in a possible military action against Taiwan in a future date.
Military action against Taiwan.
And guess where Zyca is from?
How about if France were a real threat to Germany and the US decided to sell the French M-1A2s at bargain prices, along with F-117 stealth fighters? How would you react?
The problem with China is that they may not make it across the channel TO Taiwan. They could just sink in the Taiwan Straight. Why? Because China doesn't really have the capability to get those troops over there with that much dominance. So right now the balance is fragile. If the Americans send a fleet to Taiwan in response to China's movements, the Chinese have to think long and hard if it's worth having a bunch of their equipment and men in the bottom of the sea. Now imagine the Chinese don't need to fear the American fleet anymore.

I ask you this, who is threatening who? All first, second, third, and fourth parties are threatening at each other. Taiwan threatens to break away from mainland, mainland threatens military action, US threatens China if military actions take place, US threaten EU if arms embargo is lifted. Threat....what is a threat?

The Pentagon is often paranoid sometimes when it comes to China. China's military progress is modest and there is no need for immediate alarm. If so, they can be sidetracked from the current issues that are not resolved (e.s.g Middle Eastern Issues.) What is alarming is Taiwan's Independence movement and the Korean Peninsula. If something incredibly stupid is done without any regards to consequences, the worst can happen.