Level 1: Cooperative. Person listens to verbal commands. Close combat techniques aren't applied.
Level 2: Passive Resistant. Person doesn't listen to verbal commands but gives in imediately to any contact controls. Close combat techniques aren't applied.
Level 3: Active Resistant. Person initially puts up a fight. Use compliance techniques to control the situation. Some close combat techniques applied to physically force a subject to comply. Techniques include the use of pressure points.
Level 4: Bodily Harm Assaultive. Person attacks without a weapon. Use defensive tactics to eliminate the threat. Blocks, Strikes, Kicks, etc.
Level 5: Lethal Force. Person usually has a weapon and may attempt to kill or seriously injure if not brought under control. Must be controlled with or without deadly force.
****

often they never get to level three before the person sets himself off, or an IED is used and there is no one to apprehend.

Originally Posted by bulldogg

^^^ True but those were cases of killing in a conflict where the enemy was easily identified.

The point of contention here seems to me to revolve around an excessive response to the perceived threat.

As for an easily identified opposition, I'm not so sure, as in this war the insurgency is usually not immediately identifiable, a la Vietnam. Nothing that I have read to date about this incident implies that it was any different to hundreds of others, with the exception of the response. It seems to me that if there were maybe three or four killed or wounded it could have been accepted, but 17 killed and how many wounded.

I am sure that this would not be the first event of this type, but for some reason someone thinks that it was an excessive and careless response.

Now, I'm not going to go talking out of school, but I do know that some PMCs have been less than responsible in their attitude toward civilians in Iraq.

Incidentally, I voted for option two, but I am not in complete agreement with it as I do believe that there is a possible place for security personnel, however it is not in the same role as played by Blackwater, and would require certain agreements to be put in place and clear Rules of engagement to be posted.

[quote=The Other Guy;372916]Level 1: Cooperative. Person listens to verbal commands. Close combat techniques aren't applied.
Level 2: Passive Resistant. Person doesn't listen to verbal commands but gives in imediately to any contact controls. Close combat techniques aren't applied.
Level 3: Active Resistant. Person initially puts up a fight. Use compliance techniques to control the situation. Some close combat techniques applied to physically force a subject to comply. Techniques include the use of pressure points.
Level 4: Bodily Harm Assaultive. Person attacks without a weapon. Use defensive tactics to eliminate the threat. Blocks, Strikes, Kicks, etc.
Level 5: Lethal Force. Person usually has a weapon and may attempt to kill or seriously injure if not brought under control. Must be controlled with or without deadly force.
****
Whose ROEs are these? I sent this to a soldier who was deployed with the 82nd and he said he never saw any such bull during his entire time there.