Does any body remember when I posted a really true story on how the Vietnam war memorial wall was vandalized, every one here screamed that we shouldn't pre-judge any thing. Fair enough... Now why some people don't hold themselves to the same standard and stop calling these contractors/armed people/ criminals when we don't really know what has happened?

That is hypocrisy to act like this. Isn't that?

Originally Posted by phoenix80

Do you remember when I posted a really true story on how the Vietnam war memorial wall was vandalized, every one here screamed that we shouldn't pre-judge any thing. Fair enough... Now why some people don't hold themselves to the same standard and stop calling these contractors/armed people/ criminals when we don't really know what has happened?

That is hypocrisy to act like this. Isn't that?

The FBI Report is out that there was indeed a Crime?
I cannot wait to see the Footage from the CCTV Cameras, is it on Youtube yet?
The Lab analysis of the Chemical Substance came back as what?

Phoenix...
For instances like Darfur, yes, mercenaries like Blackwater (They are mercenaries, I don't give two squirts a piss what euphemism you like to label them with) could fight for the wrong side and you'd be in heaps of trouble.
First off, right now they are on our side because we demand their services and we are paying for them.
In the after years, they will be loyal to their next loyal customer. Let's say a strong man in Country X uses Blackwater on a regular basis so that a bigger chunk of Blackwater's earnings comes from them and not the US... a situation arises and the world community wants to stop the leader of Country X's illegal activities in a neighboring country. Blackwater and the likes may get involved on the other side.
Or let's say the strong man in Country X (who is a brutal dictator by the way) wants to topple a government in Country R, who else can he better turn to for assasination and other unconventional operations than the likes of Blackwater?
And as long as the money is right, they will find a way to be there. Often if it is too controversial they will create a small company to conduct a single operation before closing it down when the mission is complete, therefore making those involved a bunch of individuals no one knows instead of Blackwater itself.

Follow 13th's lead and get back on topic.

Blackwater boss grilled over Iraq
The chairman of US private security firm Blackwater defends his company during a grilling by US lawmakers.

I liked what he said in response to a senator who asked him about being mercenaries: We're Americans, protecting Americans.

I liked what he said in response to a senator who asked him about being mercenaries: We're Americans, protecting Americans.

So, he didn't answer the question?

What he actually meant was that they are a "paid private army" (mercenaries) protecting Americans.

I don't have any great beef with what they are doing, but when they have to resort to lies to answer question it shows the standard of people that we are dealing with.

That was a really dumb as dogsh1t way to evade the truth.

Originally Posted by senojekips

So, he didn't answer the question?

He was asked if they consider themselves mercenaries and he said No, He doesnt. And I agree with him. He is not a foreigner in service of another foreign country. He's serving his own country... More power to these brave people!

It's hard for westerners to understand how middle-easterners behave.... Thats why I am skeptical of all these reports coming out of Iraq about these contractor shooting civilians on purpose. It's easy for some people in the middle-east to lie or falsify stories. It's a social habit!

Originally Posted by phoenix80

He's serving his own country...

well he should join the army

Originally Posted by senojekips

So, he didn't answer the question?

What he actually meant was that they are a "paid private army" (mercenaries) protecting Americans.

I don't have any great beef with what they are doing, but when they have to resort to lies to answer question it shows the standard of people that we are dealing with.

That was a really dumb as dogsh1t way to evade the truth.

Yes well it seems they went to great lengths to avoid the truth.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/02/wa...th&oref=slogin

October 2, 2007
Report Says Firm Sought to Cover Up Iraq Shootings

By JOHN M. BRODER
WASHINGTON, Oct. 1 — Employees of Blackwater USA have engaged in nearly 200 shootings in Iraq since 2005, in a vast majority of cases firing their weapons from moving vehicles without stopping to count the dead or assist the wounded, according to a new report from Congress.
In at least two cases, Blackwater paid victims’ family members who complained, and sought to cover up other episodes, the Congressional report said. It said State Department officials approved the payments in the hope of keeping the shootings quiet. In one case last year, the department helped Blackwater spirit an employee out of Iraq less than 36 hours after the employee, while drunk, killed a bodyguard for one of Iraq’s two vice presidents on Christmas Eve.
The report by the Democratic majority staff of a House committee adds weight to complaints from Iraqi officials, American military officers and Blackwater’s competitors that company guards have taken an aggressive, trigger-happy approach to their work and have repeatedly acted with reckless disregard for Iraqi life.
But the report is also harshly critical of the State Department for exercising virtually no restraint or supervision of the private security company’s 861 employees in Iraq. “There is no evidence in the documents that the committee has reviewed that the State Department sought to restrain Blackwater’s actions, raised concerns about the number of shooting episodes involving Blackwater or the company’s high rate of shooting first, or detained Blackwater contractors for investigation,” the report states.
On Sept. 16, Blackwater employees were involved in a shooting in a Baghdad square that left at least eight Iraqis dead, an episode that remains clouded. The shooting set off outrage among Iraqi officials, who branded them “cold-blooded murder” and demanded that the company be removed from the country.
The State Department is conducting three separate investigations of the shooting, and on Monday the F.B.I. said it was sending a team to Baghdad to compile evidence for possible criminal prosecution.
Neither the State Department nor Blackwater would comment on Monday about the 15-page report, but both said their representatives would address it on Tuesday in testimony before the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, whose Democratic staff produced the document. Based on 437 internal Blackwater incident reports as well as internal State Department correspondence, the report said Blackwater’s use of force was “frequent and extensive, resulting in significant casualties and property damage.”
Among those scheduled to testify Tuesday are Erik Prince, a press-shy former Navy Seal who founded Blackwater a decade ago, and several top State Department officials.
The committee report places a significant share of the blame for Blackwater’s record in Iraq on the State Department, which has paid Blackwater more than $832 million for security services in Iraq and elsewhere, under a diplomatic security contract it shares with two other companies, DynCorp International and Triple Canopy.
Blackwater has reported more shootings than the other two companies combined, but it also currently has twice as many employees in Iraq as the other two companies combined.
In the case of the Christmas Eve killing, the report says that an official of the United States Embassy in Iraq suggested paying the slain bodyguard’s family $250,000, but a lower-ranking official said that such a high payment “could cause incidents with people trying to get killed by our guys to financially guarantee their family’s future.” Blackwater ultimately paid the dead man’s family $15,000.
In another fatal shooting cited by the committee, an unidentified State Department official in Baghdad urged Blackwater to pay the victim’s family $5,000. The official wrote, “I hope we can put this unfortunate matter behind us quickly.”
The committee report also cited three other shootings in which Blackwater officials filed misleading reports or otherwise tried to cover up the shootings.
Since mid-2006, Blackwater has been responsible for guarding American diplomats in and around Baghdad, while DynCorp has been responsible for the northern part of the country and Triple Canopy for the south.
State Department officials said last week that Blackwater had run more than 1,800 escort convoys for American diplomats and other senior civilians this year and its employees had discharged their weapons 57 times. Blackwater was involved in 195 instances of gunfire from 2005 until early September, a rate of 1.4 shootings a week, the report says. In 163 of those cases, Blackwater gunmen fired first.
The report also says Blackwater gunmen engaged in offensive operations alongside uniformed American military personnel in violation of their State Department contract, which states that Blackwater guards are to use their weapons only for defensive purposes.
It notes that Blackwater’s contract authorizes its employees to use lethal force only to prevent “imminent and grave danger” to themselves or to the people they are paid to protect. “In practice, however,” the report says, “the vast majority of Blackwater weapons discharges are pre-emptive, with Blackwater forces firing first at a vehicle or suspicious individual prior to receiving any fire.”
The report cites two instances in which Blackwater gunmen engaged in tactical military operations. One was a firefight in Najaf in 2004 during which Blackwater employees set up a machine gun alongside American and Spanish forces. Later that year, a Blackwater helicopter helped an American military squad secure a mosque from which sniper fire had been detected.
Blackwater has dismissed 122 of its employees over the past three years for misuse of weapons, drug or alcohol abuse, lewd conduct or violent behavior, according to the report. It has also terminated workers for insubordination, failure to report incidents or lying about them, and publicly embarrassing the company. One employee was dismissed for showing signs of post-traumatic stress disorder.
The Senate on Monday gave final approval, 92 to 3, to a defense policy bill that included the establishment of an independent commission to investigate private contractors operating in Iraq and Afghanistan. The bill, which must be reconciled with a House version, faces a veto threat because it includes an expansion of federal hate-crimes laws.
James Risen, David Stout and David M. Herszenhorn contributed reporting.

Phoenix, and I guess permanent residence fighting in the regular military ranks are mercenaries then because they are technically foreigners?
And mercenary does not mean they are foreign. It is perfectly possible to be a local mercenary.