Originally Posted by MontyB

I take it you have never experienced a Haka?

I have no doubt they performed one but I suspect more for internal use than to scare the Germans because without the visual aspect all the Germans would have heard was incomprehensible gibberish somewhere in the distance which is hardly frightening.

My brother in laws father served with the Maori Battalion in Greece, Crete, North Africa and Italy, they were good soldiers but to be honest a lot of the stories you hear about them are urban legend type stories and every countries forces have them, the only stories I have heard about them actually scaring the bejesus out of anyone was due to their tendency to use German weaponry which scared the crap out of the rest of 2nd Division when when an MG-42 opened up within their own positions.

Never seen a Haka? Sure I have (you'll be please to know I am an All-Blacks fan), and I completely disagree, I think it is the screaming that is so frightening, not the "dance". Seriously, could you imagine watching a Haka on Mute? Its the noise that creates a mass physiological fear effect.

Here's a test: Play a Brittany Spears song at full blast and feel your spine shiver!!!

And remember there was an entire Maori Battalion on Crete, I don't know how many troops actually participated in the Haka, but the noise they made must have been deafening.

Actually the fighting at Crete was done at very close quarters, so close the Aussies fought hand to hand as the German paratroops dropped right INTO their positions. So its absolutely likely the Germans could have heard it. During the Ardennes US soldiers could hear the Germans sing Xmas Carols from their foxholes and I doubt the German Ardennes choir could sing as loud as a Moari chant (or whatever you want to call it).

Originally Posted by mmarsh

Never seen a Haka? Sure I have (you'll be please to know I am an All-Blacks fan), and I completely disagree, I think it is the screaming that is so frightening, not the "dance". Seriously, could you imagine watching a Haka on Mute? Its the noise that creates a mass physiological fear effect.

Here's a test: Play a Brittany Spears song at full blast and feel your spine shiver!!!

And remember there was an entire Maori Battalion on Crete, I don't know how many troops actually participated in the Haka, but the noise they made must have been deafening.

Actually the fighting at Crete was done at very close quarters, so close the Aussies fought hand to hand as the German paratroops dropped right INTO their positions. So its absolutely likely the Germans could have heard it. During the Ardennes US soldiers could hear the Germans sing Xmas Carols from their foxholes and I doubt the German Ardennes choir could sing as loud as a Moari chant (or whatever you want to call it).

This is the only mention of the Haka and is taken from the 28th Maori Battalion war diaries for its actions on Crete beginning at 1500 hours May 20th 1941...

The 22nd Battalion, hard-pressed at Maleme, had asked for help and Colonel Dittmer was instructed to send a company to Headquarters 23 Battalion, where guides would be provided for the rest of the journey to 22 Battalion. B Company was given the job but Captain Royal, who had returned from hospital two days earlier, did not know the suggested round-about route and decided to use the main road and fight if forced to. The Arawa Company left at 7 p.m. and was unmolested until close to 23 Battalion area, when 10 Platoon (Lieutenant Vercoe) encountered a few paratroops who were cleaned up without much trouble. Very soon afterwards a larger body was met and the platoon was held up until 11 Platoon (Lieutenant Pene) reinforced it. The Germans, who had concentrated around a tree, shouted 'We surrender' and at the same time a grenade was thrown which wounded two Maoris. That grenade was the signal for, as far as is known, the first use of the bayonet by New Zealand troops in the war, for with a yell of 'Surrender be ' the Maoris charged and killed twenty-four Germans. Those not actually engaged assisted with hakas. A pocket a little further on yielded another eight dead Germans, after which B Company reached 23 Battalion without further incident.

This does not indicate a "Massed" Haka aimed at a large German formation but rather a portion of a relieving Company aimed at maybe 30 or so surrounded Germans and I would suggest that it was probably more likely to be the use of the bayonet that scared the crap out of them than the Haka.

My Grandfather ( who is now 94 ) is a veteran of the battle of Crete and was one of those left behind after the Island fell.

What battalion was he with, I had two uncles who were there as well.
(Well one that I know was there and one that was meant to be there but seemed to turn up in odd spots at odd times such as Scotland).