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| | Post 11 |
| Milites Gregarius | ...making little rocks out of big rocks... |
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| | Post 12 |
| Optio | If it was a lawful order and the data currently points out that it was, they need to be punished. They signed the papers, they gave the oath, they broke it.
__________________ \"We have enough youth, how about a fountain of smart?\" |
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| | Post 13 |
| Milforum Moderator ![]() | the sad thing is there are people in active duty that side with the reservists. None of those people were combat arms though. People in combat arms generally know the importance of following orders. When the bullets fky, orders must be followed.
__________________ "The best form of taking care of troops is first-class training, for this saves unnecessary casualties." Erwin Rommel |
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| | Post 14 |
| Optio | It is interesting to see the American views on this. I have somewhat of understanding for there refusal to do what they are ordered to do. They are reservists and probably rather poorely trained so they got scared. I do think this is a leadership/training problem. I don't think you should be to quick to judge them until we know what was really going on there. I do hope that they really look in to how your reservist are prepared before going to Iraq. |
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| | Post 15 |
| Milforum Moderator ![]() | I have served with both active duty and the reserves. I can tell you that training with the reserves is a complete joke. I will judge this situation and here is why. As an E-6 or below, it is not your place to question an order. You can bring up objections to an order (the outcome is never good when you do it though), but you have to follow that order. Orders in the military are not requests. Failure to follow and missing movement are serious offences in the military. I have seen a number of soldiers get article 15's for both offences. I must remind you that this was at Ft. Campbell, not a war zone. |
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| | Post 16 |
| Milites Gregarius | I'd agree with MarkConley in that we most probably don't know the full story here, but on the face of things I personally believe that these clowns deserve all they get. Unless the order is illegal- for example in breach of the Geneva Convention- then it's your duty to obey it. If you can't deal with that then you should never have signed your name on the dotted line in the first place. Did they honestly expect as members of the military that disobeying orders would not carry any consequences? And on a less serious note, I've got to say I find it pretty ironic that there are a bunch of American soldiers complaining about their kit. Do a Google search on "poorly equipped US military"- I think you'll find the results are roughly the same as those for "French military victories" that someone suggested elsewhere in here...
__________________ The quickest way to somone\'s heart is through their chest... with an axe. |
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| | Post 17 |
| Tribunus Laticlavius | if i get this right, they did not have all of needed equipment? Well many dont. thank Bush but yes they should be punished
__________________ MICHAEL HATKEVICH, C/Capt, CAP |
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| | Post 18 |
| Milites Gregarius | Many US personnel don't? I take it you don't serve in the UK armed forces then? |
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| | Post 19 |
| Tribunus Laticlavius | its true, parents SEND armour for X-mas and B-days |
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| | Post 20 |
| Milites Gregarius | You're not exactly unique there... |
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