Duty Honor Country
Active member
redcoat said:
The Revolutionary War gave America her independence. The War of 1812 was a test of that independence.
The American War for Independance
The Revolutionary War gave America her independence. The War of 1812 was a test of that independence.
Young Winston
Banned
Doody said:
I agree with Doody. The 1812 War finally showed Britain that the US had the testicles!!!!! Bigger ones than in the WOI!!!
The WOI was a momentous and great chapter for US independence, but it was the first chapter.
America went to war with Britain in 1812 for 4 reasons :
1.) Britain was selling weapons to Indians on the fronteir. Not illegal, but it was pissing farmers off seeing presumed enemies with guns.
2.) Britain was lazily demilitarizing the American fronteir. Bases from the Revolutionary War were STILL being demilitarized and British troops were not leaving fast enough for the Americans.
3.) Britain was impressing Americans into their navy. Already been discussed, so I won't go into it. However, it should be noted that indeed the British parliament passed a bill that made it illegal to impress American citizens into their navy - as per constant request from the President and threats to use force - before the U.S declared war on Britain, but this happened mere WEEKS before Congress declared war on Britain, and in that time frame the United States hadn't heard that Britain repealed its law and battles were already being fought against British installations.
4.) America wanted control of the Great Lakes and wanted Canada to become an independent state, thus more easily we could settle border disputes and the British empire would be that much weaker. We thought incorrectly that the Candians were like us and wanted independence, but instead they successfully fought off our invasion.
So yeah, pathetic waste of life which I would hardly correlate with our indendence. Even so, we - the USA - probably lost the war due to our capital building being set aflame.
1.) Britain was selling weapons to Indians on the fronteir. Not illegal, but it was pissing farmers off seeing presumed enemies with guns.
2.) Britain was lazily demilitarizing the American fronteir. Bases from the Revolutionary War were STILL being demilitarized and British troops were not leaving fast enough for the Americans.
3.) Britain was impressing Americans into their navy. Already been discussed, so I won't go into it. However, it should be noted that indeed the British parliament passed a bill that made it illegal to impress American citizens into their navy - as per constant request from the President and threats to use force - before the U.S declared war on Britain, but this happened mere WEEKS before Congress declared war on Britain, and in that time frame the United States hadn't heard that Britain repealed its law and battles were already being fought against British installations.
4.) America wanted control of the Great Lakes and wanted Canada to become an independent state, thus more easily we could settle border disputes and the British empire would be that much weaker. We thought incorrectly that the Candians were like us and wanted independence, but instead they successfully fought off our invasion.
So yeah, pathetic waste of life which I would hardly correlate with our indendence. Even so, we - the USA - probably lost the war due to our capital building being set aflame.
Chocobo_Blitzer
Active member
Uhm, well... we did get our national anthem out of it!
The US didn't lose the war of 1812, we were kicking ass on our internal lines... Washington was burnt, but then the invading British army had it's rear handed to it in Baltimore.... the invasion of Canada... quite justified since we were suffering attacks by the pro-british indians supported logistically by English forts in American Territory (I can't be more clear about that) took a long time to get support for in congress... our invasion almost succeeded, but re were repelled, and then defeated the Brits in our own terrirory. I don't even want to bring up what happened in the south! I think the US made out pretty well after the war, but we were so freaken independant before the war it's not funny. Remember, we were capitalistic (i.e. don't judge us by the older ideological systems in Europe at that time like I suspect many of you are doing)... we didn't need a strong industrial infrastructure cause we had goods at the time to trade.... which I believe was the basis of the huge ideological debate at the time that split the nation on it's future civilwar structure. Proof of the civilwar, done by a independant populace, which had it's roots BEFORE the war of 1812, is a clear sign that the US was independant politically before it.
uh dude being a historian myself we lost, the war of 1812, and at the time of the treaty of Ghent the Brits were bringing in their troops from Europe, after making an agreement with the Prussians, who would fight Napoleon.
If the Treaty had not been made there would be no United States of America.
If the Treaty had not been made there would be no United States of America.
redcoat
Active member
Of course not, you just came secondAirborne said:
.The Indians weren't pro-British they were pro-Indian. Remember it was the US that was invading their lands not the other way around.
Also there were NO British(not English) forts on US territory. thats just an American folk-lore myth.
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The re-conquest of the United States was never an objective of the British.Time said:
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Have to agree with this.aussiejohn said:
Any nation which declares war on somebody, gains nothing and has their capitol burned to the ground, yet still claims it as a glorious victory. Must have balls of steel :lol:
mod edit:do not post back to back. Use the edit button
Duty Honor Country
Active member
I multiple invasions into Canada did not go that well. Only the one in 1814 had any real success against the british. Here is something I wrote for a different topic
Doody said:
What? Dude.... The English were still occupying American soil.... this is well established and accepted fact, we keep records have have historic sites and all that wonderful stuff. There is absolutely no doubt what so ever about this; I have no clue what thier teaching in the commonwealth, but this I know; my part of the country used to be the frontier.
And at worst the war of 1812 was a drawl, if not an American victory, burning of the capital meant nothing.... same thing happened in Russia with napoleon.... it's a port city which was in it's most infant of stages, and the invading army promtly got it's butt handed to it after it left the city.... doesn't sound like a victorious Roman army to me. In fact, the Brits was worried about Canada ceeding from the Empire like the U.S. did until the idea of granting it democratic Autonomy came up.
And at worst the war of 1812 was a drawl, if not an American victory, burning of the capital meant nothing.... same thing happened in Russia with napoleon.... it's a port city which was in it's most infant of stages, and the invading army promtly got it's butt handed to it after it left the city.... doesn't sound like a victorious Roman army to me. In fact, the Brits was worried about Canada ceeding from the Empire like the U.S. did until the idea of granting it democratic Autonomy came up.
godofthunder9010
Active member
Um, to clarify something ... the invasions into Canada were mostly half-assed on the part of the USA's soldiers, ie "Why the hell are we doing this again?" One important thing that the USA learned from that war -- you have to go into war unified and with some very definite goals, it its extremely helpful if those goals are know by and have at least SOME appeal to the soldiers fighting for you.
On the fights on our own soil -- essentially a very poorly organized US military always managed to successfully repel the Brits and saw some great success in many cases.
On the American Indian issues -- regardless of whether the US and its citizens were right or wrong in their treatment of the Indians (our behavior was shameful, but that's another topic), the British were seen as helping people hostile to the United States and its citizens.
The United States gained nothing but respect. That may not seem like much, but consider that most people in Europe saw as little more than a ridiculous joke -- something that would fall appart in time, so forth. We DID have our Independence already, but not much respect.
Its a draw in my book -- mostly because we did not have to face the full power of the British military. So its sort of a draw by pure dumb luck really.
On the fights on our own soil -- essentially a very poorly organized US military always managed to successfully repel the Brits and saw some great success in many cases.
On the American Indian issues -- regardless of whether the US and its citizens were right or wrong in their treatment of the Indians (our behavior was shameful, but that's another topic), the British were seen as helping people hostile to the United States and its citizens.
The United States gained nothing but respect. That may not seem like much, but consider that most people in Europe saw as little more than a ridiculous joke -- something that would fall appart in time, so forth. We DID have our Independence already, but not much respect.
Its a draw in my book -- mostly because we did not have to face the full power of the British military. So its sort of a draw by pure dumb luck really.
Duty Honor Country
Active member
lets keep on topic.
There is already a poll on who won the War of 1812.
There is already a poll on who won the War of 1812.
Dude, it's England. Enemy was England, nobody would get confused say if we sais England.... if we say Britian, then some dumb privateer would start attacking Breton.... so let's just say England. As to getting the sources, my unit is doing some re-arranging in the barracks, and I'll be offline for a while, but next time you see me PM me... I'm still waiting for most of my books to come in. I got a couple of books from a few colonia reinactment forts that has practically every little known skirmish fought between the Indians and the Colonist and well as Early America.